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Version 4 CW: Return to Receive Issue

Rich - N5ZC
Rich - N5ZC Member ✭✭
edited November 5 in SmartSDR for Windows

I'm wondering if anyone else has noticed a return to receive issue, while in CW, with version 4

I upgraded my 8600(non M) to version 4 early access.

While in CW, with delay set above 0 (I normally have the delay set to 250), I can hear the t/r relay place the rig back into receive, then there is a micro second of silence, vs going directly to receive.  There is enough of a T/R delay that I miss the first letter/character of a caller in a contest, Nov SS for example.

If I set the delay to 0 the above issue does not take place.  I had to run the contest with 0 delay to be successful.

If I revert back to 3.0 the problem is not there.  I've done a full factory reset as well as a cold boot, and the issue persists.

I have already submitted a help desk ticket so Flex is looking at this. I'm curious if this issue is unique to my 8600 or if others have noticed the issue.

Rich - N5ZC

Comments

  • Tom C
    Tom C Member ✭✭

    I noticed a delay too but blamed it on having a preamp, amp and transverter all involved.

    Version 4.0.1, 8600, 630 meter CW

    Tom

    N9RU

  • KD0RC
    KD0RC Member, Super Elmer Moderator

    Hi Rich, I just got my 8600 a few days ago, so I don't have a lot of operating time on it yet, but so far, no problems on CW. My CW Delay is set to 200.

    I will watch for this issue in case it is happening and I just didn't notice it.

  • Joe Uhrich
    Joe Uhrich Member ✭✭

    I had the same "back to receive" issue on my 8600 after upgrading to 4.0.1. After reverting to 3.10.15, all is well again.

    Joe AI0Y

  • Mike-VA3MW
    Mike-VA3MW Administrator, FlexRadio Employee, Community Manager, Super Elmer, Moderator admin

    Joe, if you have seen a before and after difference, please open a support ticket so it gets tracked correctly.

     https://helpdesk.flexradio.com/hc/en-us/requests/new

  • Erik Carling EI4KF
    Erik Carling EI4KF Member ✭✭✭✭

    This delay issue, for me, exhibits itself after the radio has been on for a while. Quite how long I do not know. The radio activates the relay but is not receiving for what appears to be the CW Delay time. Extend that time and the problem is more noticeable. I have it set to 350 but is now at 200ms. Even so to work a very fast CW op, as with 9U1RU, it is touch and go to get the first letter of my call (being E, a single dot). I thought at first 9U1RU was sending I4KF. After a restart of the radio it is normal again for a while. I am back on 3.9.19 until this is fixed.

  • Erik Carling EI4KF
    Erik Carling EI4KF Member ✭✭✭✭

    Also I note that what I miss while the delay is occurring, is being captured on a Skimmer. So the radio is receiving and it is the audio only that is being muted.

  • Mike-VA3MW
    Mike-VA3MW Administrator, FlexRadio Employee, Community Manager, Super Elmer, Moderator admin

    And, if you have not reset the radio, you will want to give that a try first. Doing so cleans up the database files and a few more maintenance things.

    https://helpdesk.flexradio.com/hc/en-us/articles/360020078612-How-to-Completely-Reset-a-FLEX-8000-6000

  • Roger G3LDI
    Roger G3LDI Member ✭✭

    Hi All.

    I have just changed to a new 8600 and being a CW guy, this was one of the first things I noticed. It's dreadful and I am only pleased that I am not the only one suffering this problem. I have raised a ticket, but all I have had back is advising me to do a factory reset, make some new profiles etc., but I don't want a fudge fix. I want a CW rig worthy of it being a good CW rig. I have only just found out about this and have emailed a few friends with 8600 to ask them if they have the same problem. More tickets are needed I think until the problem is fixed!

    73 de Roger, G3LDI

  • g4ivv
    g4ivv Member ✭✭

    I echo Rogers thoughts, I have just recorded and analysed the bug in 4.0.1:

    The transmit to receive switching is now more than double the selected delay and also inserts a burst of noise during the switching. I recorded the audio at various delay settings and the switching behaviour is now on my 8600:

    [transmitting] ==> delay+220mS ==> 133mS noise burst ==> delay ==>[receive]

    instead of the desired:

    [transmitting] ==> delay ==> [receive]

    This more than double the delay plus the noise burst is very annoying during CW operation.

    This did not happen with 3.9.19, and yes I did do a factory reset after updating to 4.0.1

    Jonathan G4IVV
    (ticket raised and audio sample sent to support)

  • John G3WGV
    John G3WGV Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 7

    [transmitting] ==> delay+220mS ==> 133mS noise burst ==> delay ==>[receive]
    instead of the desired:
    [transmitting] ==> delay ==> [receive]

    Jonathan has precisely described what I am experiencing on my 8600. It is sufficiently irritating that I am on the verge of reverting to 3.10.15.

    I had planned to sign up for the early access package while the $50 discount is available. This problem is giving me second thoughts about whether to bother with V4 as it doesn't seem to offer anything useful to me as a 100% CW op.

    I don't think there is much point in me raising a "me too" ticket unless the weight of the in tray influences priorities.

    John, G3WGV

  • Erik Carling EI4KF
    Erik Carling EI4KF Member ✭✭✭✭

    I raised a ticket John, no reply from them. So you won't know anything, just have to assume they have received enough reports that it is in hand for fixing.

  • Rich - N5ZC
    Rich - N5ZC Member ✭✭

    John, G3WGV,

    Per Mike, a few messages into this thread, it would be helpful if you entered a help ticket so it can be tracked.

    I'll be going back to version 3 over the weekend until this is fixed.

    Rich - N5ZC

  • Rich - N5ZC
    Rich - N5ZC Member ✭✭

    FYI, Eric of the help desk, sent me a response this afternoon.

    The issue has been confirmed and is being tracked. Hopefully it will be a fairly easy fix and an update released.

    Rich - N5ZC

  • Erik Carling EI4KF
    Erik Carling EI4KF Member ✭✭✭✭

    Ken Wells kindly wrote to me today:

    This issue has been logged as defect number: SMART-11996 – CW TX/RX Return issues in v4.0.1

    Fix coming soon

  • John G3WGV
    John G3WGV Member ✭✭✭

    This is good news, thank you Rich and Erik.

  • Dan Trainor
    Dan Trainor Member ✭✭✭

    Save that bug number. They tend to put CW issues on the bottom of the priority list.

  • K1ESE
    K1ESE Member ✭✭✭

    Flex, please fix this before the CQWW DX CW contest on November 29. It's the biggest CW contest of the year.

    K1ESE

  • WX7Y
    WX7Y Member ✭✭✭✭

    K1ESE, I would do another help desk ticket so they know there's more then a few having the issue.

  • John G3WGV
    John G3WGV Member ✭✭✭

    I would do another help desk ticket so they know there's more then a few having the issue

    This really shouldn't be necessary, or indeed, desirable. The problem has been acknowledged and assigned a defect number. It's a pretty fundamental bug that is obviously going to affect all CW ops. I would like to think that Flex would be on it very quickly. (I hope I am not proved wrong!)

  • Erik Carling EI4KF
    Erik Carling EI4KF Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 8

    I agree, John. When a bug gets a defect number there is no more to do than wait and maybe post some words of encouragement towards Flex to expedite corrections to vital issues as K1ESE has done. But to add to the Help Desk influx is indeed, as you say, not desirable. Flex ought to be on it quickly and we shall see if that proves to be the case. Meanwhile we can use our favourite V3 iteration as I am.

  • Roger G3LDI
    Roger G3LDI Member ✭✭

    I know the issue with the bounce has been given a number::

    This issue has been logged as defect number: SMART-11996 – CW TX/RX Return issues in v4.0.1

    However, John G3WGV and I have noticed another keying error which also needs to be fixed. If anaything this is more important because it happens when paddling and it might be translated as an operator error which it is not.

    It concerns the occasional "slurring " of dits. The spacing between a dit and its preceding dit or dah is much shortened, making the CW sound slurred or "peg-legged". It isd very noticeable on the sides-tone and it is also on the transmission. This leads to me error correcting for a reason which is not of my making. I use a Logi-keyer and I know that is beyond making this sort of error. So, is it worth me opening another ticket or shall I just wait and see if the problem manifests itself in the "bounce" correction version?

    Flex do not seem too concerned with CW people. We seem to be ignored to some extent. It took them 6 years to fix the CW problem on my 6600, so I don't wish to go through all that again.

    I don't have Ken Wells email address or I would have written directly to him. Are any of you guys experiencing this problem?

    73 de Roger, G3LDI

  • Rich - N5ZC
    Rich - N5ZC Member ✭✭

    Roger,

    I had a problem where I could only send dashes but no dit's. I restarted my pc and 8600 and the issue did not repeat.

    I would not email Ken directly, a help desk ticket is the best approach.

    Rich - N5ZC

  • Roger G3LDI
    Roger G3LDI Member ✭✭

    Hi Rich.

    Point taken. OK, I will raise a ticket for that problem thenf. Hopefully Flex can get both fixed at the same time.

    73 de Roger, G3LDI

  • Mike-VA3MW
    Mike-VA3MW Administrator, FlexRadio Employee, Community Manager, Super Elmer, Moderator admin

    Just an FYI:
    Personal technical support emails sent directly to individual staff members are usually not acted on, and there are several reasons for that.

    First, FlexRadio uses a centralized support system to track, measure, and manage all customer issues. This ensures visibility across the entire team — so if someone is out of the office, another team member can step in to help. When emails go directly to a staff inbox, they bypass that process, meaning they can easily get missed or delayed.

    Second, internally we’ve largely moved away from traditional email for day-to-day communication. Most of our engineering and support collaboration now happens in Slack and other team-based tools. That means email is no longer the primary way things get done inside FlexRadio.

    For the fastest and most reliable response, please only use the HelpDesk tool — this ensures your request isn’t lost and is properly tracked and acted on.

    Thanks for understanding — this helps us help you more efficiently.

  • Sherman Banks
    Sherman Banks Member ✭✭

    FYI I tried a factory reset after the V4.01 upgrade and it did not fix the CW TX/RX return issue. Hopefully it will fix the SmartSDR disconnect problem on band changes.

  • Rich - N5ZC
    Rich - N5ZC Member ✭✭

    Unfortunately the CW issue was not resolved with todays release of 4.1.3

    Rich - N5ZC

  • Adrian
    Adrian Member ✭✭

    I was really hoping to upgrade this week but have three contests (+CWTs) in the next three weeks where I have to rely on CW working well. Can anyone tell me if the problem is only seen when using Maestro? Thx, 73, VE7NZ

  • KD0RC
    KD0RC Member, Super Elmer Moderator

    Hi Adrian, the little stutter of RX audio is gone, but the entire duration is still twice the selected value of CW Delay.

    I would do the upgrade (you can always go back) and set the CW Delay to half the desired value and I think it will work the way you want.

    I did some testing today, and it seems to work reliably down to zero ms when listened to on another receiver.

    I plan on working some CW this afternoon and evening. If I trip across any issues, I will post back here.

  • Rich - N5ZC
    Rich - N5ZC Member ✭✭

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