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no TX from WSJT-X FT8

Michael WheatleyMichael Wheatley Member ✭✭
edited June 27 in Third-Party Software
I have been using WSJT-X v 2.1.2 with modes FT8 & FT4 successfully on my Flex 6400 SSDR v3.1.8 for some time.  I normally start WSJT-X when I start my radio and just leave it run monitoring the band. It works fine for a while, but if I leave SSDR & WSJT-X just sit there running for a couple of hours, when I come back to it and try to transmit (eg: call CQ). WSJt-X keys the radio but there is noting transmitted (no RF output).  If I close and restart WSJT-X it works fin again ... for a while.

I have WSJT-X radio rig set to FlexRadio 6xxxx and the rest of the settings work fine.  Test CAT works fine and PTT is set to CAT.

Has anyone encountered this problem?  Is there a fix?

Michael -- KM6LHD

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Comments

  • Wilbur DoolittleWilbur Doolittle Member
    edited February 2
    check dax control and see if they are greyed out or asleep per say 
  • Rich McCabeRich McCabe Member ✭✭
    edited February 3
    It has happened to me a few times too. Keys radio, shows a signal on the TX Dax channel and have to restart the software to get it to work.

    I do not do much FT8 anymore so have not pursued it. 

    But I do have same issue.  Seems crazy as I am keying the radio and showing a signal level in TX I would assume it would transmit.
  • N8AUMN8AUM RETIRED Member ✭✭
    edited February 3
    My 6600 does that frequently and DAX shows that WSJT is sending tones but they never make it to the radio
    Win7 with 3.1.8 
  • Al K0VMAl K0VM Retired Member ✭✭
    edited February 3
    couple things to try... 
    if the TX stream level in the DAX GUI not normal, try restarting WSJT-X
    or
    if the SSDR level meter is not normal during TX try toggling the TX Stream button on-off-on in the DAX GUI. 


    AL, K0VM
  • N8AUMN8AUM RETIRED Member ✭✭
    edited February 3
    Hi Al, With my setup stream seams normal, If memory serves me right, restarting  DAX made it work again?  Next time I will toggle DAX on DAX than SSDR before doing a complete restart 

    73 N8AUM  Vidas
  • Michael WheatleyMichael Wheatley Member ✭✭
    edited February 3
    This problem has nothing to do with my Flex 6400 or SSDR, it's a problem in WSJT-X:

    If I set Audio-Soundcard-Output to my PC Speaker in WSJT-X settings and then call CQ I can hear a continuous high pitch tone as it transmits.  If I then leave WSJT-X sit monitoring for a couple of hours and then try CQ again, I hear nothing from my PC speakers.  If I restart WSJT-X and call CQ again, I hear the high pitch tone again.  This is completely repeatable.

    I am pursuing it on the WSJT-X Groups.io forum.

    Michael -- KM6LHD
  • Rich McCabeRich McCabe Member ✭✭
    edited February 4
    Well in my case restarting WSJT does nothing. Restarting SSDR does.

    Pretty sure its the Flex
  • edited February 4
    For me most times restarting WSJT-X does the trick, but just last week I tried that, tried restarting SSDR but in the end only a reboot of the 6400 (switch off and remove power) did it. I know other people have the same problem with other rigs, I had it with a K3 previously so my vote is with a WSJT-X problem, and yes, all my USB's are set to be permanently alive. BTW when this happens the DAX is showing normally, just no RF out.
  • N8AUMN8AUM RETIRED Member ✭✭
    edited February 4
    Same with my setup
  • RiaRia Member ✭✭
    edited February 10
    This is a long-standing bug in WSJT-X
  • Rich McCabeRich McCabe Member ✭✭
    edited February 4
    Hard for me to believe its a WSJT-X bug in my case.

    The Flex is keyed and the DAX shows TX levels and no power output.

    Not saying there is not a WSJT bug, but in my case I don think this is it.

    Rich

  • Al K0VMAl K0VM Retired Member ✭✭
    edited February 4
    If you're seeming levels in the DAX GUI TX Stream, its not a WSJT-X problem. 
    If you're not seeing levels on the SSDR Level meter, try toggling the stream off-on in the DAX GUI. 
    If you're are seeing levels on the SSDR Level meter, then check to make  sure the your TX tone is within the SSDR TX filter limit ( low cut/high cut).  
    AL, K0VM
  • Tim - W4TMETim - W4TME Administrator, FlexRadio Employee admin
    edited February 6
    I have fixed this by deleting or renaming the wsjt-x.ini file and let WSJT-X create a new default file that I re-setup manually.
  • Arvind MallyaArvind Mallya Member ✭✭
    edited June 6
    Tim, can you explain what you mean re-setup manually, do you mean delete WSJTX and reload, reload what? It almost looks like a Windows time out function. If I leave it for a while running it seems to lose the synch with WSJTX. I have to reload it and then works fine
  • Tim - W4TMETim - W4TME Administrator, FlexRadio Employee admin
    edited February 5
    Deleting WSJT-X will not work.  There is a wsjt-x,ini file that resides in the %APPDATA%localWSJT folder ( this is documented in the WSJT-X documentation). 

    You rename (preferred) or delete the wsjt-x.ini file and restart WSJT-X.  When you do this a new default wsjt-x.ini file will be created and you have to manually re-enter you call, grid, set up radio control and configure the audio input and output to use DAX RX and DAXT TX respectively.
  • Harold RoseeHarold Rosee Member ✭✭
    edited February 8
    It seems like everyone has a different fix so here is what I did.

    I changed DAX channels from 1 to 3 and it has never failed again except when I had to reset the radio and it went back to channel 1.

    Try changing to another DAX channel and see if that helps.  You have nothing to lose.

    Harold
  • Mark_WS7MMark_WS7M Member ✭✭
    edited February 6
    Yes... For me this seems not a WSJT-X issue but rather a DAX issue.  I saw this lack of transmit issue the other day on 80m FT8.  Restarting DAX fixed it for me.

    The partner issue for me in this is that even though DAX shows normal actively and looks normal WSJT-X will stop decoding.  A restart of DAX (changing NOTHING else) will get it to start decoding again.

    Changing from DAX 1 to 3 helped this some and make it last longer.

    Some one mentioned in some thread that when the decoding stops that there is like a high frequency signal superimposed on the DAX audio and it can be seen in the WSJT wide graph.  I can't see it or do not know what I'm looking for.

    But restarting DAX fixes it.  It also fixed the lack of transmit issue as well.

    Running 3.1.8 on a fairly fresh Windows 10 install.
  • Tim - W4TMETim - W4TME Administrator, FlexRadio Employee admin
    edited February 6
    Note that when you restart DAX, you are also reinitializing the audio interface in WSJT-X (or any connected digital mode application) as well.
  • N8AUMN8AUM RETIRED Member ✭✭
    edited June 6
    I use to run WSJT years ago for years and dont recall ever having problems with my 5K and PowerSDR,. Does anyone really know if its DAX or WSJT or both ?

     
  • Arvind MallyaArvind Mallya Member ✭✭
    edited February 6
    I use my Flex 5000A with WSJTX-FT8 never had a problem, once the com ports and Vac are setup it never changes. I also found I can drive it harder and not generate lot of harmonics.
  • Mark_WS7MMark_WS7M Member ✭✭
    edited February 6
    That is understood Tim.  However in my testing when the "DAX Corruption" problem appears, restarting WSJT-X ONLY does not result in reestablishing decode (or perhaps transmit but I have not verified that).

    I systematically when the decode issue appears tried the following steps:

    1) Confirm time keeper to be accurate and using good sync pool

    2) Reconfigure audio in WSJT-X -  Select different DAX, save, Reselect correct DAX save.  No effect. Decode would not continue.

    3) Reconfigure audio in WSJT-X to different DAX channel - Change SSDR slice to use new channel.  About 50% success with this.  Sometimes it does not does not restart decode.

    4) Restart WSJT-X - No effect.  Decode would not continue

    5) Restart DAX - Works every time.  Decode restarts almost immediately and lasts until the next time something in the chain fails.

    I have confirmed similar behavior using SSTV program.  Working with a friend who was expecting images I would send he texted me at one point and said the image looked like garbage.  We were both S10 to each other.  He transmitted an image to me and it was full of strange looking noise.

    I restarted DAX and resent my image to him and it was crystal clear and same thing on receiving his image.   

    I observe this behavior on three different Windows 10 machines.  All are running 3.1.8.  I admit I have only tried the SSTV test on my main shack machine.

    I am at this point pretty convinced that DAX has some corruption issue that periodically appears.  The symptom is enough noise usually in the receive audio that it messes up decoding problems.

    The transmit or failure to transmit issue seems to be another problem that is fixed by a restart of DAX.   But I have only experienced that one a few times and I have not had the time or chance to do careful analysis of the broken piece.   In the several times this has happened to me, DAX restart did fix it.  Whether it was DAX or WSJT-X I cannot say.

    I will say that this corruption issue with DAX receive is bad enough that I don't do much FT8.  I would love to leave FT8 on all day long and let it decode up a storm but my experience is that it will not run that long without human intervention.
  • Tim - W4TMETim - W4TME Administrator, FlexRadio Employee admin
    edited February 6
    If restarting DAX is the key mitigating action, then I suspect that the issue is related to the PC generating excessive DPC latency that is resulting in DAX audio buffer corruption.
  • Michael WheatleyMichael Wheatley Member ✭✭
    edited February 10
    There are two different problems being discussed in this topic:

    1.  No TX from WSJT-X:  No audio is being produced by WSJT-X when it keys the radio (eg: call CQ).
    2.  WSJT-X stops decoding:  No audio is being received by WSJT-X.

    The problem I am having, and the reason I started this topic is #1 above.  This problem occurs after the computer monitor is turned off by the screen sleep function in Windows (Windows Settings-System-Power-&Sleep-Screen: When plugged in turn off after X minutes). 

    This problem can be reproduced reliably on my PC by:

    1. Start SSDR and WSJT-X.  Call CQ to verify that audio is being sent to and received by SSDR.  If it is, the DAX window will show TX steaming .  
    2. Set the screen sleep timer in Windows settings to 1 minute.
    3. Wait for the monitor to turn off.  Wait a few more seconds and then wiggle the mouse to turn the monitor back on.
    4.  Call CQ again.  When WSJT-X keys the radio the DAX window will show nothing being streamed .

    WSJT-X can be restored to its correct state by closing the program and restarting it.  No other remediation restores WSJT-X to its correct state.

    Other fixes has been suggested here:

    -- erase wsjt-x.ini in %appdata%/local/WSJT-x and recreate it by reconfiguring WSJT-X
    -- change the DAX channel, perhaps to an odd number
    -- toggle DAX RX or DAX TX off and on
    -- restart DAX

    None of this work for me.  The only remediation is to restart WSJT-X and then it works correctly until the monitor turns off again as a result of the Windows sleep timer.  Note that powering off and on the monitor using its power button does not cause the problem or remediate it.

    I believe the problem is in WSJT-X because the problem does not occur with FLDigi or HRD Digital  Master 780 in which I have CAT and DAX configured identically to WSJT-X.  Some users in the WSJT-X forum on Groups.IO report that this is a known problem in WSJT-X that its developers have not been able to find.  Now that I have a reliable way to reproduce the problem, I will continue to discuss it on the WSJT-X forum.

    In the meanwhile, the only way I can find to avoid this problem is to set the screen sleep timer in Windows settings to "never" and power on an off my monitors manually.


    Michael -- KM6LHD

  • Dave - G3SBPDave - G3SBP Member ✭✭
    edited February 8
    Both of the problems mentioned are now plaguing me since the last Win 10 update:-

    1. Occasionally WSJT-X won't transmit as described above.

    2. WSJT-X stops decoding. Signals shown on the WSJT-X graph show as fuzzy and not clearly defined.

    3. Until the recent Win 10 update I could run at least six WSJT-X decoders with no problem whatsoever but now even decoding three separate steams generally means they will all stop within a short time.

    Sometimes restarting WSJT-X works but generally it means restarting SmartSDR. I have not tried stopping/starting DAX but will do so but of course restarting SmartSDR does that.

    My Screens are all on permanently so it is nothing to do with that.

    Would be most grateful if we could clearly decide what is causing this to happen.

    Dave. G3SBP.



    PS: Just tested and as suggested closing and re-opening DAX resolves the problem immediately!
  • Mark_WS7MMark_WS7M Member ✭✭
    edited February 8
    Tim, 

    Interesting...  I downloaded a DPC checker and it is showing this one system as marginal.  Sometimes it gets bad.  Not sure what is up but I will dig in further.

    I can't test the other system right now but I will try to get to that soon.

    One question:  My DPC checker is saying that the system should be "ok" for audio with minor dropouts.  If that is the case why would DAX not recover if the drop out was just momentary?

    I get that it could cause problems for some period of time, maybe cause a full FT8 packet to not decode but why would the problem persist?
  • Michael WheatleyMichael Wheatley Member ✭✭
    edited February 8
    DPC checker shows no problem on my system
  • N8AUMN8AUM RETIRED Member ✭✭
    edited February 8
    Dave, regarding the "fuzzy" decodes I found that the AGC /gain setting has a great effect. In FT8 or WSPR modes I run with AGC off and than play with the gain settings until I find the sweet spot so both weak and strong signals look clean on WSJT's waterfall and doesn't exceed 60 on it's input level. also dont forget to check DAX output so its not over driving. Hopefully that makes sense ?
  • Dave - G3SBPDave - G3SBP Member ✭✭
    edited February 8
    It only goes "fuzzy" when the DAX fails. resetting DAX and all works perfectly but only for five minutes or so before it happens again.
    Dave
  • Dave - G3SBPDave - G3SBP Member ✭✭
    edited February 10
    Further update on the DAX timeout:-

    Tim suggested going back to the previous Win 10 update but in doing that a message came up saying a new "update" was available and to try that if having difficulties.
    System updated from OS Build 18363.592 to 18363.628 and all now working as before with four FT8 frequencies being decoded with no problem.
    Dave.
    G3SBP.

  • Francesco DoenzFrancesco Doenz Member ✭✭
    edited June 22
    After three days of searching and trying all the suggested fixes in the forums, renaming the wsjt-x ini file as suggested by Tim worked for me...but too bad, three days gone crazy....

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