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Dear Flex, Please fix VOX ASAP

Sergey KN7K
Sergey KN7K Member ✭✭
Dear Flex,
I patiently waiting for the VOX fix for a while on Flex 6600.
I typically not complaining and not trying to give you a hard time.
All my life all I used a different brand radios and never had a problem with VOX.

I opened ticket on September 26, 2019 after talking to RadioSport and Flex(Mike) and worked with Flex to replace Radiosport cable as it seems like intermittent connection - VOX dropped in the middle of each SSB QSO.

I am avoiding SSB contests on the FLEX for the last 1.5 years because of that issue and would like to know when it is going to be fixed.
My Radiosport headphones connected to the radio, not Maestro.

My ticket is closed, This issue has been logged as defect number: 7724

I never use or ever had a pedal and VOX is a pretty basic function on any radio that simply should work. So, please do not tell me to purchase a pedal, I personally do not find it practical.

Here is the video of the VOX problem:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ThzeBWJ6_3Qf2gkWMkEavYOzp0MpXK_z

Bottom line - needed VOX fix ASAP.

Thanks
Sergey, 

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Comments

  • Johan _ SE3X
    Johan _ SE3X Member ✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Having the same problem. I have always used fotpedal during contest, but VOX when doing casual Q's and when running the Swedish Ham Association network every Sunday.  This is very annoying and I too look forward to a fix of this problem.

    I have F6700, Heil head-sets with Heils own adapter for frontpanel jack and a Shure studio mic, connected on the back via XLR. 

    Same problem with VOX regardless which audio input I'm using.

  • Steven WA8Y
    Steven WA8Y Member ✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Please repeat the experiment/demonstration with your Flex mic.
  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 2020
    This is interesting to read about. The only way I ever use my 6500 is VOX every single day and have never had a dropout, unless I have  a setting set wrong.
  • Johan _ SE3X
    Johan _ SE3X Member ✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Why repeat it? I have had quite a few trx and never had a problem with VOX, other than with my Flex. And why shouldnt VOX work regardless of which microfon I'm using?
  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Johan, I believe Steven may be asking because, one thing that works really well on a Flex is the VOX. The trouble your having is not very common. As i said, I have never had a dropout over the years. It seems that a setting or a problem with the mic is causing it. I am only saying this because your problem is not wide spread among users. Play with the sensitivity slider to find the best spot for that mic.
  • Rick  WN2C
    Rick WN2C Member ✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Have you changed your cat 5 cable between radio and computer?
  • Wilbur Doolittle
    Wilbur Doolittle Member
    edited January 2020
    I think they send 6e cables with the radio.
  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 2020
      Rick  Would changing the cat cable effect how VOX works?
  • Johan _ SE3X
    Johan _ SE3X Member ✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Ok Bill, well using a handmic would never be an alternative anyhow. Need both hands on the keyboard when contesting. Guess I will continue with the footpedal.

    When it come to settings .. guess I have spent several moonlaps trying different settings ;)  

    Before upgrading to V3 I never had this problem. Well, have to wait and see if there will be some bugfix in the future. 

    I'm so used to using a footpedal that it's not a big deal. And I mainly use the 6700 for contest. Not much of a rag chewer i guess.

    Ps. I would much more ask Flex to give us the "switch" to disconnect this awful auto update of profiles. I can't say enough how much I dislikes it. Unfortunately I like my 6700 so much for it's other properties that I have to live with it. Otherwise I would have sold it long time ago.

    Flex development - Give us the "old" profiles back!
  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Johan, I didn't realize you were on V3. I don't know if the VOX problem is V3 related. Guess that is why I have never had a problem with it, I am not on V3.

    Now that you changed the subject to Auto Save Profiles. The last update from Flex is that they are planning to keep it but change the way that it works. There are some very good reasons for Flex to keep it business wise. I believe changes are in the works.
  • Johan _ SE3X
    Johan _ SE3X Member ✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Ok, Thank you Bill. I'm very unhappy with the way profiles works today. I guess we will have to wait and see what they come up with. If it doesn't change a lot from today, I guess however much I like my 6700, I have to take a serious discussion with myself if I should start looking alternatives.

    Ps. I think this VOX issue might very well be V3 related. But I really like the possibility to use my Maestro with SmartControl in V3. So I don't really consider going back to V2.
  • Ken Wells
    Ken Wells Community Manager admin
    edited March 2020
    I watched your video, and it seems that you only have the problem when you turn the VOX delay to 0.  I cannot imagine why you would ever need to run the VOD Delay that low.  That would be faster than syllabic VOX speeds, i.e. trying to hear even between syllables in your transmission.  I would think it unlikely that you would ever seriously notice the difference between 0 and even a setting of 5 or 10.  

    The VOX response, when the mic is connected directly to the radio is extremely fast, and the available VOX delay can be much faster than most radios I have used in the past.  

    If turning it up even to 1 or 2 on the slider prevents the problem, then that indicates an obvious solution.  Don't turn it to 0.

    Another issue may be that you may be running your VOX Delay at a setting that is shorter than your TX Delay setting.  (the setting that prevents hot-switching your amplifier.)  The solution to this may be to set your VOX Delay to just a little longer than the TX Delay.

    The only time I have ever heard of anyone with VOX Dropout issues has been when the user was trying to set the VOX Delay to 0 as if they were trying to do the equivalent of vocal Full-breakin CW Keying.
  • Johan _ SE3X
    Johan _ SE3X Member ✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Ken, I have my VOX set to 30 and Delay betwen 8 and 10. Works Ok with my Heil Pro-Set and Pro-Set Micro, both with HC-6 inserts. Still have dropouts if that's what it should be called. As written earlier I have played around with both settings a lot. Didn't have this before upgrading to V3.

    But I have never thought about a possibel connection to my TX Delay settings. I'll have a look into that next time I have some time to play with the radio.
  • Sergey KN7K
    Sergey KN7K Member ✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Ken,
    Thank you for reply.
    I do not ever use settings 0, it was a way to reproduce the issue.

    I found that around 10 I am getting less drops an reasonable VOX response time, but TX drops still happening and completely unpredictable. With 20+ delay I am getting about 0.5 seconds delay or more than unacceptable for a quick exchange.

    My findings is that Delay slider closer to 0 make drops more often. I use 12, that typically gives a good response time.

    Question: What Delay scale of 100 is represents?
    It is not milliseconds, as when I set full scale of 100 I am getting response delay for about 3 seconds. So, when I set 10 or 20 how do I know what this slider means in msec or sec?

    If you have a good reliable way to configure VOX to prevent the drops please let me know.

    I assume that Bug recorded because Flex was able reproduce this issue and placed it to development/fix. Correct me if I am wrong.

    Thanks
    Sergey, KN7K
  • Sergey KN7K
    Sergey KN7K Member ✭✭
    edited March 2020
    I did not get my question answered, so i will try one more time:
    What is the unit's of Vox Delay scale? 
    What is number 10 or 20 represent? It is not 10 or 20msec.
    Anything below 12 has a bad drops off.
    Above 15 or 20 drops off less frequent but still there.
    If i put delay above 50, i did not see drops yet, but delay is quite big and I may miss 1-2 words from other operator.

    Thanks
    Sergey, KN7K
  • Jay Nation
    Jay Nation Member
    edited March 2020
    Sergey

    The scale units of most of the slidersin SSDR is in percentages. All the way up is 100% all the way down is 0% or off. The operator needs to adjust the sliders so that they work the way he expects it to. The scale readings.numbers are really more mnemonics, like if 33% worked last time I had it adjusted correctly, the 33% might be a good starting point the next time.

        SDRgadgets

    #FlexRadio IRC chat

       73, Jay - NO5J

  • Sergey KN7K
    Sergey KN7K Member ✭✭
    edited January 2020
    Thank you Jay
  • Sergey KN7K
    Sergey KN7K Member ✭✭
    edited March 2020
    I took my time and explored more options with VOX settings, no joy.
    I can keep increasing VOX delay to even a half scale and while drops become less frequent, delay becomes too big to miss quite a few words from another station.
    Even with such large delay I sometimes find that I have no TX and talk to myself, it is getting very frustrating!

    My TX delay is 20, I experimented with VOX delays 20+.
    The issue cannot be seen every TX, it is intermittent, I found VOX usually would stop working when you talk long.

    Bottom line: unless defect #7724 is fixed I CAN NOT recommend Flex6600 to be use with VOX, only pedal or other mechanical switch.

    I can leave with some other caveats but this is very basic function of any radio and should work properly.
    I never criticize any radio manufacturer, I just state the fact and share the findings.

    Hopefully it will get Flex attention and get it fixed, unless I am doing something wrong and Flex can share how to adjust it properly to avoid the drops.

    Sergey, KN7K 
  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 2020
    That's interesting,, I only operate with VOX on my 6500 with out any issues.
  • Robert White
    Robert White Member ✭✭
    edited March 2020
    I have the same problem as Sergey. I am using a Heil PR-781 mic that I purchased with my Flex 6500. Random, spurious drop outs that cause the radio to be unusable with Vox.
  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 2020
    I am on V2.6.1. I have never had a drop out. what version are you guys on. I wish I could help out but without ever seen this dropout I don't know how to help. But I can make it drop out if I have my settings set wrong.
  • Robert White
    Robert White Member ✭✭
    edited March 2020
    I am on 3.1.8
  • Tom W3FRG
    Tom W3FRG Member
    edited March 2020
    I am also on V 3.1.8 and on SSDR if you set the Vox slider and also the Delay you can get the VOX to trigger correctly.

    Using a dummy load at low RF Transmit power, practice adjusting the VOX and Delay settings.
    You should also keep the mike gain peaking at or below the "-10 " on the Level meter.

    GL  Tom W3FRG
  • Robert White
    Robert White Member ✭✭
    edited March 2020
    Hi Tom - Yes, did all that even using a separate microphone. Still have the same problem. Sergey?
  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 2020
    I'm trying to think of what differences there are from your radio set up from mine as my set up works great.
    I think your using a desk mic?. I am using a head set. If your using a desk mic try making sure your close talking the the mic, say an inch or two from the mic at the most. I wonder if your using DEXP? maybe try it off? There has to be something doing on. I always thought the VOX was one of the best working features of SSDR for me.
  • Robert White
    Robert White Member ✭✭
    edited March 2020
    If I get my mouth within an inch of the mic it seems to work OK. I turned off the downward expander. Seemed to help some.
  • Dudley  WA5QPZ
    Dudley WA5QPZ Member ✭✭
    edited March 2020
    Sergey and others,

    If you are using speakers,  try either turning the audio from the speaker down,  or decrease your mic gain,  or try with closed headphones.   Have to remember that there is no anti-vox,  so speaker audio turned up loud will trigger the mic audio or keep it from releasing correctly..   Also the DEXP setting can effect the VOX also,  default is set to "70"   This is to keep background noise down..  

    Once you have it set ,  remember that the profile settings automatically set,  but are held by each band..   

    Maybe this helps,
    Dudley
    WA5QPZ
  • Robert White
    Robert White Member ✭✭
    edited March 2020
    Don't use speakers, only headphones.
  • wb4qda
    wb4qda Member
    edited March 2020
    Surgi I’m not being flippant. Have you tried increasing your mind gain?
  • Sergey KN7K
    Sergey KN7K Member ✭✭
    edited March 2020
    Guys, if you look to my 1st post - i use Radiosport CF60 head set http://www.arlancommunications.com/products/amateurRadio/radioSport/rs60CF.asp, no speakers.

    I first notices VOX issue when I received 6600 and open later ticket as I suspected the bad cables. I used the same Radiosport headset for many years with Yaesu FT5000MP with no issues, just installed new cables for Flex. So, headset is fine.
    Flex replaced cables as I was still in warranty period. It did not resolve the issue.

    Now, let me say it one more time, VOX responding fine to start TX and mostly fine on the short transmissions, like Call sigh and report. Now if you try to make a conversation you start to see an intermittent drops in transmit, I still see my microphone level changes as I speak, just no TX. I have to stop for a sec or two and can TX again.
    My current delay set to 22, Mic in the middle of of scale, no Equalizer for TX.
    Tried DEXP and without DEXP, do not see any difference. My room is pretty quiet, so, usually I do not use DEXP.

    Current ver is 3.1.8. The same issue was there with 2 previous versions since i received the radio.

    Sergey, KN7K


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