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My Take on SSDR v3

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Comments

  • Scott Russell - N1SER
    Scott Russell - N1SER Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    Duane, why did I buy it? I don't think I wrote off the reason, more so it isn't relative. But since you ask. Because I can. While at this time I don't have a good use case for multi client I still like to see what it's about, how it works and what all the hype was about. I'm different than others in that I like to upgrade to the latest whatever. I guess it's curiosity. Also what was my option, really. Don't upgrade and have an outdated version for the rest of the time I own this radio? Never move ahead because I don't like something? I purchased the Flex because of the software updates and all that it can be. I'm just disappointed. I'm fully aware of the Ten Tec story but I doubt it was all because of free software. I agree, there should be more customer input on new features. Or at least a good way of passing on the ideas.
  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 2019
    Flex did not stop support for PSDR because it was poor, they wanted an intire new direction. PSDR was not and still not able to do what Flex wanted to do going foreward. PSDR is Geralds creation.
  • Duane_AC5AA
    Duane_AC5AA Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    Just a quick comment - if you don't upgrade to Ver 3, you're not stuck forever.  I believe Flex is going to offer an update for 2.x to cover some bugs (don't know about any new features), and when Ver 4 comes up, if it has content you want, just upgrade to that for $199, assuming that's still the upgrade price.  You'll get Ver 3 and Ver 4 contents then.  Simple.
  • Burt Fisher
    Burt Fisher Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    Bottom line, did a single person say 2.x wasn't worth it? Hams will vote with their feet, they will walk away.
  • Kevin
    Kevin Member
    edited April 2019
    :)
  • Scott Russell - N1SER
    Scott Russell - N1SER Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    Yeah that’s true Duane. I’m just a sucker for new software and updates. I like the experience and knowing what it’s about. That way I can be a better mentor to someone interested and be able to discuss it knowing first hand. While expensive I guess in that regard it was worth it.
  • Kevin
    Kevin Member
    edited April 2019
    Hi Kuby:

    Are you suggesting hams are not Flex's biggest customers? Commercial or government users? Now you've got me wondering...

    We have an Alpha team that pays Flex to test their software.
    We have a Beta team (hamdom) that pays Flex to beta test their software.
    Then it is sold to gov/com'l when fully baked? 

    You know something? That makes a terrible amount of sense to me. Could it be? Can't be. (Now I'm all in conspiracy theory mode.)

    Kev
  • James Eastham Jr
    James Eastham Jr Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    I’m hoping Flex will add more enticing features to V3 ....the multi op feature is not of interest to me. If they add something else I might be tempted. What would really be disappointing is having V3 stay the same (except bug fixes of course) and then along comes V4 with something I really like and I have to have V3 already installed. I ran a training software company before I retired. Product development is a wonderful thing for customers but customer satisfaction and loyalty is Equally important. From what I’m reading V3 May be a real tax on the considerable loyalty satisfaction level Flex has earned. The bad press had clearly started and coupled with the PGXL debacle FLEX needs to tread carefully. I hope the revenue from V3 is worth the cost.
  • Scott Russell - N1SER
    Scott Russell - N1SER Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    Seems plausible to me Kevin. Haha
  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 2019
    News Alert!! I am not buying V3 either. My staion operation will not benefit from it. But I am not going to complain about, it's just not for me.

    But I will say congrats to Flex for a release that puts Flex ahead of the competition again. This is no small feat, very complicated to pull this off.

    For the remainder of V3 I would expect Flex to continue building on Multi client and allowing it to do even more things.
    Nice thing is I can maybe buy V4 and get V3 as well under one price.

    That's about all I want to say, A few people here are venting their anger at Flex and that's perfectly fine, why not? So continue as you were..lol.
  • Don
    Don Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    With all due respect, the $7000-$8000 Kenwood TS-990S performed dismally in the Sherwood Engineering Labs receiver performance measurements, coming in at 33rd place.  The $7000 Flex 6700 took first place.  Even the $1,000 IC-7300 came in at a respectable 19th place.  The TS-990s performs at the level of a 30 year old radio.  My Nikons don't charge for updates either but then they hardly ever update and they are nothing like a radio.
  • Scott Russell - N1SER
    Scott Russell - N1SER Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    Don, I think the TS-990 is an awesome looking radio. If I had that kind of money I'd probably have had one a couple years ago. Too bad for the Sherwood test. Regarding Nikon, Sony has an awesome feature called Eye-AF which focuses on the subjects eye. The new update enhances that feature to be full time and also... Animal Eye-AF! How cool! True the old DSLR technology is nothing like ham radio but the new cameras now are a whole new world.
  • James Del Principe
    James Del Principe Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    and my Brownie Hawkeye never needed a SW upgrade. HI HI.    But the audio on the TS-990 S really does sound nice.  It truly is a superhet with DSP, (RF, IF & AF) so, yes, you could say it is a 30 year old design.
  • Pat N6PAT
    Pat N6PAT Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    @Howard,

    I certainly don't recall asking for MultiFlex. Exactly how many customers did ask for that particular feature?


  • Dave - W6OVP
    Dave - W6OVP Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    ... - who is FLEX's biggest customer(s)? Surely not HAMdom. So logic would say that Multi-Share is an offshoot of a bigger customer request.
     
    That's a very astute question.

    When 6000 was first released I joked that the sterile, uninspiring and shortchanged  screen looked like something out of a government contract. (Been there, done that.)

    Whether or not, it has seemed clear all along that this project was not responsive to ham users requests, as if it was dancing to another piper. Like maybe a spinoff from a primary customer who had very rigid specs?

  • Kuby, N6JSX
    Kuby, N6JSX Member
    edited April 2019
    Before V4 & $199, can FLEX fix/patch (make work) V2... 'SSB DSP' to be as good if not better then all their competition? All I've wanted since starting this FLEX adventure with a 3K/PwrSDR is a good SSB DSP; unfortunately SmtSDR is STILL the same/bad as PwrSDR.

    Rhetorical questions: will FLEX (parrot MS-Windows not being backwards compatible) so you must have V3 installed (purchased) to get V4 (installed/working) - forcing all to buy both?  Will V4 be a glorified V3 Service Pack/bug-fix like Win98SE was? Will V4 work on WinXP or Win7?
  • KY6LA_Howard
    KY6LA_Howard La Jolla, CA. Paris and Sablet FranceMember ✭✭✭
    edited April 2019
    @kuby

    While Flex Radio's may not be appropriate for those who are computer challenged, there are many videos both on the Flex site and on YouTube

    GOOGLE IS YOUR FRIEND

    Here are but a few aimed at Newbies from the Flex site

    https://www.flexradio.com/videos-flex-6000/ 

    Youtube

    https://www.google.com/search?q=youtube+flexradio&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-US:IE-Se...=


  • Bill -VA3WTB
    Bill -VA3WTB Member ✭✭✭
    edited April 2019
    Flex has stated, that we should only buy a version that we want, and not untile. and any new version purchase also cover past versions as well.

    All new versions have a main feature involved, V2 was about wan, and V3 is about multi Client, who know what feature V4 will be about.

    Support for Win 7 is starting to slide because Microsft is dropping Win 7 as well.
    Win 10 is the Windows being supported for some time.
  • Dave - W6OVP
    Dave - W6OVP Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    >HAMS ARE CHEAP. ANYTHING OTHER THAN FREE IS TOO MUCH.

    I think this old saw is mostly a false flag. Happy Hams spending $200 are not cheap. It's when they are unhappy at not being listened to or feel they have been short-changed they complain. They are not "cheap".
  • KY6LA_Howard
    KY6LA_Howard La Jolla, CA. Paris and Sablet FranceMember ✭✭✭
    edited April 2019

    @Kev

    " If the most requested feature in the past two years has been multi (I have serious doubts)"

    If you had spent time on this forum over the past several years, you would easily conclude the multi-client and using the knobs on the Maestro and M series as a mirror control surface for SSDR were the most desired ADDITIONAL Features requested by customers.    V3.0 achieved Multi-Client  Hopefully V3.1 will achieve the Control Surface Mirroring so much desired (albeit one of the 3rd Party Apps seems to have done that already)

    As Flex says, if you do not like or need the features of 3.0 DO NOT BUY IT

    V2.5 will have the bug fixes and changes of 3.0 without Multi-Client.  it will be FREE but you will have to wait for the code to be merged backwards to 2.5


    Note: I said ADDITIONAL Features.. yes I agree that some current features could use improvements - those NEW improved features might be part of V4 albeit I have no idea what Flex plans.
  • Pat Hamp
    Pat Hamp Member
    edited April 2019
    As someone who works for a software driven hardware company I can tell you this is a dilemma many companies face. You build hardware with a software/firmware platform and its sort a catch 22 because you first have to fix errors and make the hardware operate as promised, then of course comes the improvements where you essentially make no profit if you don't charge something for them. Programmers do not work for free, and thus the smaller the company the more critical overhead becomes. We all want new features, and if we had to buy hardware for them, AKA a new radio, we would groan but ante up. Is 199 a fair price? The market is actually in the process of determining that right here right now. I have been pleased with Flex support and the 6300 I own, and would hope they survive in the market to support it into the future. At some point once I see a rev of V3 that addresses some things, I am willing to pay something because I see value in the product as is and hopefully in the future. In the end each person has to make a value-cost judgement and we as owners will have to live with the company going forward or not. This just some observations having seen companies come and go and live by the market forces they actually create. It is in the end up to each owner to value or not.
  • KF4HR
    KF4HR Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    I suspect Sony just might have a few more employees and products than Flex, so perhaps Sony can afford to give away software upgrades, along with the man hours required to development the software, documentation, etc, and all that easily gets absorbed into Sony's massive company profits.  (Save that.)

    Rather than having the option to spend $199 on a software upgrade perhaps Flex should adapt the policy that ICOM, Yaesu and others use.  No more long term software enhancements but instead just supersede the 6400/6600/6700 models with a whole new radio every 2 or 3 years.  And like ICOM and the rest, no trade-ins.

    Some people don't know when they have it good.
  • KY6LA_Howard
    KY6LA_Howard La Jolla, CA. Paris and Sablet FranceMember ✭✭✭
    edited April 2019

    FYI- there are Flex Radios on the International Space Station.. and Flex admits to making radios with Multiple Receivers...


    FOLKS--> Get your conspiracy tin foil pyramid hats on
  • Don
    Don Member ✭✭
    edited April 2019
    FWIW  I think the 990s is a really beautiful box.
    I just added a D850 to my Nikon lineup.  I thought long and hard about the new mirrorless Nikon but the D850 won out.  I'm going to wait for the next gen of mirrorless before I take that plunge...probably about 4 years. 
  • Homer1952
    Homer1952 Member
    edited April 2019
    To add to your comments Larry, I already paid for the less than world class DSP in my 6400.  So any improvements to the DSP should be as free UPDATES, not via paid UPGRADES.

    Bob  W8RMV
  • Al_NN4ZZ
    Al_NN4ZZ Loganville GAMember ✭✭✭
    edited April 2019
    Hi Howard,

    RE"  " If you had spent time on this forum over the past several years, you would easily conclude the multi-client and using the knobs on the Maestro and M series as a mirror control surface for SSDR were the most desired ADDITIONAL Features requested by customers."  

    I have the "ideas" list displayed on my community view and sorted by user votes. 

    MultiFlex, MultiClient,  or something similar does not show up in the top 10.  In fact I can't find it in the top 100.   Maybe I missed a less obvious reference.   

    There is an idea to create a Maestro like control as a replacement to the Flexcontrol but that was the closest I could find.  And it is more about the knobs and not about multi client. 

    https://community.flexradio.com/flexradio/topics/maestrocontrol-the-next-generation-flexcontrol

    Is there another place or process to see the most requested ideas beside the ideas list and count of use votes?  

    Regards,  Al / NN4ZZ  
    al (at) nn4zz (dot) com

    P.S. -- I have some notes on how to set up to see the ideas list sorted by votes if anyone else want to take a look. 




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