IC7300

Barry N1EU

Nah, it's not going to happen.  They're pretty much sold out in the USA right now at $1500.  Maybe $1200-$1300 this summer though.

W9OY

You may see $50 off during Icom days or at Dayton. This radio was designed to maximize Icom's profits worldwide and will be marketed as such.

Walt - KZ1F

I'd be shocked if there wasn't way more margin in that pricing than any of their other radios. Not that I'm an ICOM expert. But, if I wanted to pinch US manufacturers, I'd do something like that.

W9OY

I would be more than shocked I would be incredulous.  The radio apparently sold out in the US in 2 weeks, shooting the **** out of Dayton discretionary impulse budgets.  Flex did a similar thing 2 years ago at Dayton, except Flex doesn't have front page back page and center page advertising in the magazines like Icom, so Flex used word of mouth.  Icom simply pulled a page out of Flex's playbook after they recognized the hunger for SDR.  This year Flex is gunning for the contest and DX market.  Soon enough those 7300 owners will be in the market for a real SDR.  Once the bigshot at the local ham club trades in his pair of K3S's for a 6700, Flex will have nothing to fear regarding sales.  The bigshot will do the selling for them, just the same as he did for Elecraft in the past.
 
I've heard a few around on the bands and while they sound good my head didn't **** off in amazement.  I would not for example be able to pick a 7300 out just by hearing it's audio.  What this really means is a BIG dent in analogue radios, and it's a big dent because hams are ready for SDR.  I hear a lot of discussion regarding the fact the 7300 doesn't need a computer  DUH!  How do you do SDR without a computer?  It merely says to me there is more education that needs to be done explaining how SDR's work.  The company who owns that narrative and excels in that education will in the end be the SDR winner.

The reason I re-started my blog was in some way to try and address this education (or lack there of).  I may not be that great at it but at least I'm out there swinging and not giving left handed comments about pinching US manufacturers.  The reason KY6LA gives his hamfest talks is to address this education or lack there of.  He also understands the hunger for the facts.  Hams are hungry for real honest knowledge about SDR and are wide open to education, as knowledge grows so will obvious purchase decisions be made.  Last year K9CT owned a stable of K3's and microHam stuff, this year 6700 and 6500's.   

I wrote this blog post in response to the 7300.  I never mentioned the 7300 once.

http://sdr-w9oy.blogspot.com/2016/04/why-i-own-flex-6500.html

let me see you work 2 DX peditions simultaneously on the same band with a 7300.  let me see you work 2 DX peditions cross band full duplex with a 7300.  

I wrote this one for the same reason.  Never mentioned the 7300 once.

http://sdr-w9oy.blogspot.com/2016/04/ep2a-on-rtty.html

In 10 minutes I went from zero RTTY capability to setting up split RTTY DX pileup capability and having Iran in my logbook.  I  broke a major pileup in 3 calls using a vertical and 200W.  It's the third RTTY contact I ever made in my 53 years in ham radio.  It is the radio system that made that contact not me.  All I did was make a couple menu choices and push the buttons, and I didn't have to buy $100 in extra software to do it.  Let me see you do that with a 7300.  My success was strictly based on the forethought of the Flex API. the reconfiguration of DAX, and the integration Dave AA6YQ did between SSDR and DXLabSuite.  

I got Iran on CW on the 30M and 40M bands in 7 minutes using a vertical and it was still an hour before my sunset.  No mention of the 7300.  None are needed as the versatility speaks for itself.  

http://sdr-w9oy.blogspot.com/2016/04/ep2a-****-****-30m-then-40m.html

I owe that to the power of skimmers and panadapters and third party software like DDUTIL, SDR-Bridge and DXLab and the ability of being able to read the visual cues of a pileup, after spending hours and hours honing my ability to read a pileup.  In a pileup knowledge is power.  Knowing where to place my transmitter such that I'm on the freq where the DX is listening means contacts in my logbook and not hours and hours of pointless calling.  Let me see you do that with a 7300 with that dinky little screen and no skimmer capability.   

I like to write these little narratives as my own personal ham radio adventures but in reality what I am doing is show casing the raw horse power of the radio system we all own, and in the end it's that capability that will sell these radios, and I am very clear about my goals.  You want a Yugo buy a Yugo.  You can quack on and on about the cheapness of your Yugo.  You want a Porsche buy a Porsche.  A 6300 will cost you $1000 more than a 7300  

73  W9OY

SteveJ

The discussions that the 7300 does not need a computer is relating to an external computer.  Flex radios require an external computer.  New SDR radios coming in the future will be of the type that does not require a computer.

km9r.mike

What Lee was pointing out, both Flex 6k and late comer icom utilize a processor inside the radio to run the software of the SDR. Most modern day hams enjoy utilizing a PC for CAT control of their rig. I imagine even the 7300 owner will pine for the ability of CAT control of their rig with a PC. Flex, imho, made the right move and did in-house CAT control of their rig with SSDR. This is value added for me. Going retro with knob control of SDR adds no value for me. For some however, knobs are hard to let go of. 

Walt - KZ1F

Mike, they have that! The 7300 works fine with icons remoting software. On the other issue, you're both right. I, too, think that's what Lee was alluding to but the 7300 has an FPGA controlling program as well as software to create the pan, service interrupts from the rocker switches and tuning knob etc, just like Maestro. But instead of requiring separate software to control the physical UI, it's all in one chassis.

James Whiteway

There is a dealer in North Texas, Main Trading Company that was selling the 7300 for $1,399.00 at the Belton, Texas hamfest this weekend. He sold out all that he brought and told me that he would sell me one at that price if I called him this week. So, there must be a fairly decent margin for him to sell them at $100 off list price already.
james
WD5GWY

km9r.mike

Walt ,correct. Some ops seem to be hung up on knobs or a fear of utilizing a pc to control their rig yet love when wjst-x controls their rig to operate jt65. How can I possibly operate jt65 w/o a knob ? Oh wait jt65 software renders the knob obsolete.

 My only concern with adc's and rig based SDR processing is a paradigm shift in adc design rendering present day adc's obsolete or running out of rig based processing power. So far so good.

W7NGA

It's just an interesting and affordable radio. Good for it.
I own twenty oscilloscopes ... really hard to justify that except that I love oscilloscopes.
I love radios too ...

W9OY

Steve 

The 7300 clearly has a computer,  its likely a cheap tablet and it likely controls the radio.  This is my point regarding education, you need some.  Whether the computer resides inside or outside of the box is merely cosmetic.  Flex pioneered the all in one with the Flex 5000C 

http://rigreference.com/en/rig/4485-FlexRadio_FLEX_5000C

The horse power of the computer in this radio was rather diminutive and this was the problem and will likely prove to be the problem with something like the 7300.  Like with a Yugo, you can't improve it's horsepower.  Once it runs out of steam it runs out of steam.  This is not trivial.  Ten Tec made a rig called the Orion and it had a DSP that ran out of memory as features were added, and the TT users were nothing if not feature hungry ( I was one of them).  Once the memory was gone NO MORE FEATURES even though TT continued to promise features would be coming real soon.  Every time they tried to add a feature something elsewhere would break.   That was the day I sold the Orion before it's value plummeted and bought a SDR-1000.  You can see where Ten Tec is today.

73  W9OY

Walt - KZ1F

Dan, I have a Heathkit 5MHz dual trace scope if you're interested.

Robert KB6QXM

I own multiple HF rigs including a Flex 6500 and now an Icom 7300. One thing that irritates me about the 7300 is when you go to WWV for instance, the pan adapter stops working as it is outside of the ham bands. My Flex does not do that. I do not get a "Scope Out of Range error" with the Flex. I want to use the 7300 for shortwave listening. I can use it as a receiver, but again the pan adapter does not work in the shortwave bands. I like the audio of the 7300. If I could get the functionality of the Flex and the transmit audio of the 7300 in a Flex, then I would put the 7300 on the market tomorrow. I also do not see a community page like this for Icom products. Another plus for the Flex camp.

Robert KB6QXM

Here is what I find as little quirks of the 7300:

I just bought a 7300 as I hear them on the air and I just love the audio quality of the rigs. I am mostly a Flex Radio guy, but I decided to do an side-by-side comparison of my Flex 6500 to to the Icom 7300. Granted they are not in the same class of radios, but I wanted to determine the pros and cons of each radio. Here are a few negatives for the 7300. 1) When you leave the ham bands the spectrum and waterfall display will stop working and you will receive a "Scope out of range" error. Considering that I want to use the radio for Shortwave broadcast band receive also, this is a real shortcoming on the 7300. My Flex radio spectrum scope works no matter the frequency. 2) I also do not find a community for Icom where Icom support reads the community and make suggestions to the firmware/hardware engineering staff. 3) The RF gain is not a true RF gain on the 7300. 4) The BA-1 software configuration is like a science fair to setup. 5) The internal clock resets quickly if the radio is not powered up for a relatively short amount of time. 6) No separate RX antenna input. Granted you get a lot for $1,000 USD and a Flex 6XXX series is 2X-7X the cost of a IC-7300, not including the options, but some of the quirks of the IC-7300 would not have taken any more design time to work out the simple irritants of the IC-7300.

Robert KB6QXM

Adding to the shortcomings (in my opinion) of the 7300:

1) When you leave the ham bands the spectrum and waterfall display will stop working and you will receive a "Scope out of range" error. Considering that I want to use the radio for Shortwave broadcast band receive also, this is a real shortcoming on the 7300. My Flex radio spectrum scope works no matter the frequency.

2) I also do not find a community for Icom where Icom support reads the community and make suggestions to the firmware/hardware engineering staff.

3) The RF gain is not a true RF gain on the 7300.

4) The BA-1 software configuration is like a science fair to setup.

5) The internal clock resets quickly if the radio is not powered up for a relatively short amount of time.

6) No separate RX antenna input.

7) No HDMI video output, so if you want to output the spectrum scope to a larger monitor, that can only be done with the BA-1 software and or accessory that can be purchased and added to the rig.

Again, granted you get a lot for $1,000 USD and a Flex 6XXX series is 2X-7X the cost of a IC-7300, not including the options, but some of the quirks of the IC-7300 would not have taken any more design time to work out the simple irritants of the IC-7300.

Butch

Adding a Radio Analog PTRX-7300 board to the IC-7300 (sync'ed to a SDRPlay RSP1A receiver) allows the IC-7300 sync'ed spectrum display to be displayed on a PC screen, and provides "Flex-like" look and feel to the 7300's band scope. This modification also adds the SAM (Sync AM) mode reception.

KF4HR

Robert KB6QXM

8) Another item that I do not like about the 7300 is that the clock is only a 24 hour clock. You cannot select AM or PM when you are setting the clock.

Ken Hansen

1) I don't understand your first complaint - the "issue" you describe is due exclusively to operator CHOICE. You can have the bandscope display a defined portion of spectrum, and when you tune out of the defined section, you get the 'out of band' message. Set the pan adapter to follow the VFO ('centered'?) and the scope follows you across the range of the radio.

2) Icom monitors various radio-specific groups in groups.io but does not respond. Historically, Icom prefers one-on-one support - call them, email them, they'll answer.

3) no comment

4) RS-BA1 is not the only game in town for remote controlling an IC-7300. The Elecraft sponsored RemoteHams.Com software is no harder to set up than WSJT-X and is free. HamRadioDeluxe, Win4Icom, RemoteTX, MFj's RigPi, and others also support remote operation at varying prices, and some offer remote bandscope.

5) OK - did you buy the radio to save on a shack clock? This is a silly issue that only really impacts people who store their radio rather than operate it/leave it on a 12v circuit when not in use.

6) Hello - it's a $1,000 entry-level radio. Workarounds are possible for well under $100. The Dual-receiver IC-7610 has RX antenna jack.

7) See Number 6) above. The Dual-receiver IC-7610 has a DVI connector for ext video.

current production Flex 6000 series radios start at $2,000, the Icom retails for half the price - is there a reason this apples-to-oranges comparison is in any way taken seriously?

Ken Hansen

8) Seriously? Lack of AM/PM 12 hour clock is a problem?

if you really want to compare an Icom radio with the Flex 6000 series, the comparison is between the $3,300 single SCU 6400M w/ATU and the $3,000 IC-7610 with dual, independent receivers that can either share one antenna or each have their own antenna, RX antenna jack, DVI port for ext monitor, and so on.

Each has its strengths and weaknesses, and the features and price are closer to each other.

Butch

Interesting that this Post started back in 2016 as an IC-7300 price issue, then died for nearly 4 years, then became reserected as an ICOM vs Flex comparison. Gotta luv these Forums! :) (I wonder if the ICOM Forums have Flex posts? hi)

My IC-7300/PTRX-7300 combo is paired with an Alpha 87A. My backup station. The popular IC-7300 certainly provides a lot of **** for the buck and works fine but most of the time I find myself using my Flex-6700 & PG-XL.

KF4HR

Robert KB6QXM

@Ken Hansen I own both radios. I was comparing the radios. I have stated that there is a significant difference in price point between the two radios. If you read all of my posts then you may not have flamed on me. I was not comparing a 6300 to a 7610. I was comparing to a 7300. The thread was for an Icom 7300, which I own. A Flex 6500 is what I also own. My comments are "observations" and not "complaints". I also belong to the Icom group.io group.

Haven't you seen online comparisons on YouTube before? I beta test as a hobby through a professional organization. Professionally I am a leadership level Product Manager in the Silicon Valley. I have years of experience in comparing products side by side. Again, these are "observations" and not "complaints" This was a string on the 7300, not a 7610. I do not own or have ever used a 7610, therefore I cannot "observe" the differences.

Thank you for your comments. 73

Butch

Interesting that this Post started back in 2016 as an IC-7300 price issue, then died for nearly 4 years, then became resurrected as an ICOM vs Flex comparison. Gotta luv these Forums! :) (I wonder if the ICOM Forums compare models to Flex gear? :)

My IC-7300/PTRX-7300 combo is paired with an Alpha 87A. It's my backup station. The IC-7300 provides a lot of **** for the buck and works fine but most of the time I find myself using my Flex-6700 & PG-XL.

KF4HR

Ken Hansen

Robert,

I know, I know, kicking an old thread, but just to answer the question you raised there was some comparison between Flex and IC-7300/7610, with the consensus being that IF you wanted remote operation, Flex has the upper hand. IF you wanted to receive/operate two receivers ON DIFFERENT antennas (for example monitor 6M while operating on 40), the Icom has the upper hand. IF you are OK with a computer interface, the Flex offers a lot of capabilities for a reasonable price (6400 at $2K), but if you are "Old School" and want to twist knobs, the Icom wins.

It helps that at least one Flex employee actively participates in the IC-7610 group, and a fair number of "civilians" in the group own both Flex and high-end Icoms (myself included).

Ken, N2VIP