K6TU Remote - release announcement V1.2

  • 3
  • Idea
  • Updated 4 years ago
First of all, sincere thanks to all the folks who have helped test K6TU Remote and to everyone else for their patience.  The test group has done stellar work helping get the new application tested together with my suggestions for usability improvements etc.

K6TU Remote V1.2 is the first general release of the application and is now available in the Apple AppStore:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/apple-store/id1013143753?mt=8

IMPORTANT:
  1. K6TU Remote requires an iPad Air or more powerful CPU/GPU iPad (Air2, Pro etc) to provide adequate CPU and graphics performance for seamless operation of the app.  The application moves a lot of streaming network traffic and is graphics intensive.  Although the app will run on older iPads, screen updates will lag/overrun and the audio will break up with pops when using finger gestures to tune, zoom etc.  It was simply impractical to provide adequate performance on the older units.
  2. If you use K6TU Remote over a VPN connection and Cellular Data, be aware that you will consume approximately 1 GB of data per hour of operation when using high frame rates (24 fps) on the pan adaptor and waterfall.  Reducing the frame rate and line duration of the panafall will reduce consumption but even at lower levels of update (still eminently usable), you will still consume at least 250 MB per hour.  Using WiFi to connect to the remote VPN is strongly recommended.
K6TU Remote is a free (as in beer) down loadable application from the AppStore.  As downloaded, the app is full function for receive operation on a single slice.  Enabling transmit and dual slice receive operation requires an in-application subscription purchase.  For US customers, a 30 day subscription is $9.99 and a 1 year subscription is $99.99.

A purchased subscription provides full transmit/dual slice operation on all the iPad devices you have registered under your Apple ID providing they are all registered to iCloud with your account.  You must be logged into iCloud to access your subscription on each device.

NOTE:  This release (V1.2) provides support for phone transmission on SSB and AM only.  See release plans below for more details.

An active subscription will work with all releases of K6TU Remote during the subscription period without additional cost.

Support


Support for K6TU applications is available via a Google Group K6TU Remote.  This group provides support for both the K6TU Control and K6TU Remote applications - the group is moderated and applications to join the group can be made at:

https://groups.google.com/forum/embed/?place=forum/k6tu-support#!forum/k6tu-support

You can find documentation and FAQs for K6TU Remote at:

http://k6tu.net/ipad


Future Release plans

I am already working on the next release.  This is planned to include CW Support using an on-screen keyboard or using an external Bluetooth keyboard.  The release will also provide basic logging capabilities in app or via a third party logging application.  Details will be available on the support group.

Subsequent releases are planned to include station integration (external hardware will be required) to allow control of rotor, amplifiers etc.


Thank you again to everyone for their support and patience.
73 and may High Rate and ATNOs be with you!

Stu K6TU
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
  • released to the AppStore!

Posted 4 years ago

  • 3
Photo of Tom--W4FAS

Tom--W4FAS

  • 44 Posts
  • 10 Reply Likes
Congratulations Stu,
I already fired up my IPad Air and downloaded the K6TU Remote App. It looks great and I am sure I will have a lot of fun with it.
I hope you enjoy great success with K6TU Remote. You deserve.it.
73,
Tom
W4FAS
Photo of Paul Christensen, W9AC

Paul Christensen, W9AC, Elmer

  • 323 Posts
  • 138 Reply Likes

Stu,

Looking forward to this.  I purchased an iPad mini last year.  Looks like I may need to buy myself a new Xmas gift this year!  A shame that none of the present mini models have the computing horsepower as I prefer the smaller screen size for my operating apps.  What I need is an "iPad Air Mini" model to come out for the holiday season.

Paul, W9AC

Photo of AE0MW

AE0MW

  • 104 Posts
  • 28 Reply Likes
The iPad Mini 2/3 is essentially an iPad Air. It uses the same processor but clocked slightly slower, and it has a reduced quality screen. The iPad Mini 3 is an iPad Mini 2 with TouchID.

The iPad Mini 4 is a bit more confusing. It got a great screen upgrade from the 2/3, and Apple bills it as very similar to the Air 2, but it uses a different processor and a slightly faster clock speed. Unfortunately, it has 1 fewer cores in that processor so the Air2 still out powers it.

As far as how each perform with K6TU Remote, I can't comment. I have an Air1 and a Mini2, but I haven't had a chance to play with the app yet.
Photo of Luke Reynolds

Luke Reynolds

  • 57 Posts
  • 2 Reply Likes
I loaded it on my ipad mini and Im amazed at how well it works. Im having a little problem finger sliding it to the exact frequency but no jitter no anything. I already purchased a 1 month trial!
Photo of KY6LA - Howard

KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

  • 3727 Posts
  • 1578 Reply Likes
you can manually input the frequency by touching the frequency numbers and then use the keyboard for input
Photo of DK1EY

DK1EY

  • 177 Posts
  • 48 Reply Likes
Absolutely great! Thanx a lot.

VY73
Thomas
DK1EY
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Thanks to everyone for the positive feedback!

I have not tired the latest iPad Mini (just released a few weeks ago) but it has a 1.5 GHz processor according to:

http://appleinsider.com/articles/15/09/15/ipad-mini-4-uses-overclocked-a8-processor-faster-than-2014-iphones 

I think this places the Mini4 between the horse power of the Air and Air2 - but YMMV and so this is not a recommendation until I can see how the app works on that model.

I also have not yet been able to try the app on the Pro - Apple forgot to send me an evaluation unit so I'm waiting for next week to purchase one.  Over time, its likely there will be a Pro version of K6TU Remote - a lot more real estate to use for interesting control options!

One getting fine tuning - Howard already many the manual input suggestion but my preference is to...
  • Pinch to zoom in
  • Use the finger drag close to the bottom of the slice filter window
  • Zoom back out as necessary
The tuning step applied when you drag your finger on the slice filter window is proportional to the vertical location of your finger (as describe in the friendly documentation on my web site)...  at the very bottom, the tune interval is 1 Hz.  At the top, the interval is designed to keep the slice directly under your finger.

After a little while, the zoom, tune, zoom operation becomes instinctive and very fast.  Faster with practice than tapping on the frequency display and entering the freuqency on the pop up keyboard.

Stu K6TU
Photo of KD8TVB

KD8TVB

  • 49 Posts
  • 11 Reply Likes
Excellent App Stu!

I did loose Ant2 today, likely a profile issue... I had it this morning, but now only have Ant1 on transmit.

Howard KD8TVB
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Hmmm....  you should be able to change the antenna... pull up the TX controls (swipe RIGHT from the left screen edge),  then tap the TX controls.  if you tap on the Antenna button, it will display a drop down list that shows you a choice of antennas.  Select ANT2 and you should be back in business.

Stu K6TU
Photo of KD8TVB

KD8TVB

  • 49 Posts
  • 11 Reply Likes
No, I have Ant 1, Ant 2 and xvrtr
Photo of KD8TVB

KD8TVB

  • 49 Posts
  • 11 Reply Likes
Ant 2 is my fav
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Odd.  Please do these steps.

1. Before you start the connection to the radio by tapping on its image, swipe LEFT from the right edge of the screen to pull up the debug controls.
2. Tapp on the stepper control + side to get the Debug level to say Verbose
3. Enable logging by tapping the switch so it shows on
4. Tap Done
5. Connect to the radio

Wait a few seconds and now disconnect from the radio.

Pull up the debug controls again, the log file we ant is likely #2 on the list (ie the second one down) - tap on it to select - now hit the email button.  This will pull up an email form to send me the log file as an attachment.  Add yourself as a CC so you can check the file has more than a couple of lines, hit send to email me the log.

The log is a simple text file so you can read it with any editor.

Quit the app and fire up SmartSDR.

Check and see that it will allow you to select antenna 2.  Assuming it does, please use the profile manager (from under Settings, Global Profiles) and delete the profile K6TURemote.

Exit SmartSDR and re-run the app.  See if Ant2 returns...

Sorry for the hassle!
Stu K6TU
Photo of KD8TVB

KD8TVB

  • 49 Posts
  • 11 Reply Likes
Sent log, will get the profile work done tonight... Baseball training for my 9 year old, my it guys can not figure out how to let me vpn through sonic wall to talk to radio remote, odd :(
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
My bad - there is a bug that affects the manual selection of port ANT2 on 6300's only. You can preselect ANT2 using SmartSDR and then save the profile.  This will remain in effect when you start the app.

I will fix this and re-release - likely in a couple of days then it will be about a week before the update shows in the app store (sorry but that's the "Apple" way - even for update releases).

Again, this impacts 6300 only - 6500 and 6700 are not impacted.

Thanks for reporting this and sorry it wasn't caught during the alpha testing.

Stu K6TU
Photo of KD4HSO

KD4HSO

  • 53 Posts
  • 3 Reply Likes
Wow, great app. Listening in the background as I type this. Have not tried TX, but RX is fine on an iPad3.
Photo of K1FR

K1FR

  • 110 Posts
  • 9 Reply Likes
Downloaded and briefly tried the app Wednesday evening.  Worked really well.  But now every time that I change bands the app abruptly quits.  Happens when tapping in new freq in slice display as well as when tapping band button in the app's control panel.

Have tried rebooting iPad, the 6700 and uninstalling/reinstalling the app.  Nothing knowingly changed in anything else in iPad or Flex.  Just me?  Thanks.

73, Tom
K1FR
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Tom,

Please try the following: first, I'd like to capture a debug log of what is going on.
  1. From the radio chooser, before you tap on the radio picture to connect, please swipe LEFT from the right edge of the screen.
  2. This will display the debugging controls.  Please tap on the stepper + control until it says Debug Level VERBOSE.
  3. Click on the enable logging switch to turn logging on, now press DONE.
  4. Connect to the radio, change bands.
When you say the radio abruptly quits, does the app return to the radio chooser (disconnects from the radio) or does the app literally quit?

In any event, please get back to the radio chooser and again bring up the debug controls.  Assuming we have captured the issue, the log file we want is the second one from the top of the list of log files.  Please tap on it to select and now tap on Email Log.  This will bring up an email window with the log file attached to it.  You might want to cc yourself on this message to check the log file has more than a couple of lines in it.  The log file is simple text so any application like NotePad, TextEdit etc will open the log.  Please email that log to me.

You might try changing bands with the band buttons on SmartSDR and run the radio through all the bands making sure that there is one pan adaptor and one slice per band.  Assuming this works ok, please try connecting with the iPad app again and see if the app changes bands ok.

If it doesn't or if SmartSDR also abruptly disconnects from the radio, we need to fix the issue.

I suspect that the persistence database in the radio is causing something to happen when you change bands.  We need to reset the persistence data.
  1. If you have global profiles that you have configured in the radio, the first step is to go an export these using SmartSDR.
  2. Once you have done this, please reset the radio to Factory Defaults.
  3. Now you should be able to run the application on the iPad again.
Please let me know how you get on.  If this doesn't work, please email me and I will schedule time with you for a phone call to discuss live.

Thanks and sorry for the hassles.
Stu K6TU
Photo of K1FR

K1FR

  • 110 Posts
  • 9 Reply Likes
Stu:  thanks.  I will try all the above when I get home this afternoon.  Just for clarification though - the app literally quits and must be started again.  73, Tom K1FR
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Thanks for this - I will check and see if there are any crash logs that have been sent to Apple.  This is a first report based on a band change.

Stu
Photo of K1FR

K1FR

  • 110 Posts
  • 9 Reply Likes
Stu:  

Problem fixed!

Just sent you the log file after the problem occurred again.  Then went to next step you suggested - using SSDR to step through all bands. Started the app after that, and all is well.  Stepped through all bands without issue.  Must have been something gooned up in the persistence database as you suspected.

Sorry to trouble you with self inflicted issue here.  Thanks for the super fast help,  

Looking forward now to playing around with the app.  Great work!

73, Tom
K1FR
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Tom,

Thanks for the debug log - it was inconclusive as the log ended shortly after the band change was commanded.  I'm perplexed with what undoubtably caused a crash due to some information from the radio.  This I have not seen before despite several months of testing with the alpha test team for the app.

Glad we found a way to resolve it.

Stu K6TU
Photo of Paul Christensen, W9AC

Paul Christensen, W9AC, Elmer

  • 323 Posts
  • 138 Reply Likes

This morning, I purchased and installed K6TU Remote on my iPad Mini.  Spectacular results.  Just my opinion, but it seems like the Mini is a capable and qualified device. 

A few comments for future enhancements:

1) Ability to quickly and easily "snap tune" to the nearest 10Hz, 100 Hz, or 1kHz without needing to keypad-enter the slice frequency;

2) Variable receive-bandwidth selection;

3) "Pinch" control of the vertical scale to compress-expand dB range of screen. In the alternative, up/down buttons to accomplish same.

Congrats, Stu.  This is an awesome app.  Highly recommended.

Paul, W9AC

Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Thanks - that's good to know.

I plan on making the filter sizes configurable just as the K6TU Control app does.

Its "on the list" (tm) :-)

Stu K6TU
Photo of KD4HSO

KD4HSO

  • 53 Posts
  • 3 Reply Likes
Stu,

Could you make the side menu translucent instead of white, so one can sort of see what's going on behind it?
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
I will take a look...
Stu K6TU
Photo of K0UNX

K0UNX

  • 107 Posts
  • 30 Reply Likes
Stu, you're a champ!  I'm "lovin' it!"

SNAP tuning would really be super.  I'd suggest 500 Hz steps, since that's the standard for SSB "channelization."   Perhaps near the transmit button, labeled, 
- TUNE +
so we could just tap, landing exactly on a kHz mark or a .5 mark.

While tuning down at the bottom of the active frequency gives narrow tuning, I keep overshooting.  Maybe it is my age with a little shake setting in...
Jim
K0UNX
Photo of David Decoons wo2x

David Decoons wo2x, Elmer

  • 1334 Posts
  • 284 Reply Likes

Good suggestions Paul. I concur.

Nice job Stu.!


Dave wo2x

Photo of DK1EY

DK1EY

  • 177 Posts
  • 48 Reply Likes
Can anyone recommend an external Mike/Headset and share the configuration?
Photo of David Decoons wo2x

David Decoons wo2x, Elmer

  • 1334 Posts
  • 284 Reply Likes
You can use the Apple lightning to USB cable and a Griffin iMIc. This allows headsets with separate 3.5 mm plugs for mic and headset. I am using a Heil Proset Elite with the IC element using the Lightning to USB and iMic. A little EQ adjustment and it works fine!
Photo of Gary Robertson - KY5R

Gary Robertson - KY5R

  • 79 Posts
  • 2 Reply Likes
Like DK1EY, I would like to use an Headset/Mike with my iPad. Does it matter if the headset uses Bluetooth or the 3.5mm connection. Love the new IPad app!!!
Photo of Al / NN4ZZ

Al / NN4ZZ

  • 1844 Posts
  • 669 Reply Likes
Hi Stu,
I pre-ordered an iPad Pro (wifi + cellular model) yesterday.   I'll be downloading your app when it gets here.   Since I'm CW only, I may wait until there is CW paddle support before upgrading to the full version.  Should look nice on the big pro screen....

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
6700 - HW......... V 1.5.1.70
SSDR / DAX...... V 1.5.1.152
CAT................... V 1.5.1.0
Win10  
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Al,

I have not yet tested the app on the Pro but it should work fine.  CW support with a paddle is a long way out.  The first release with CW will support an on-screen keyboard or a Bluetooth connected keyboard.

Adding a paddle will require special hardware (yet to be developed) - to be blunt, the market size for this is so small, I doubt it will get done - simply no return on the investment.

Folks don't understand the amount of effort required to give them everything they want.

Sin dinero = sin producto.

Pretty easy equation.
Sorry 
Stu K6TU
Photo of Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

  • 201 Posts
  • 32 Reply Likes
I understand keyboard / Bluetooth keyboard for sending but will there be any decoding of cow signals beside the operator themselves?
Photo of Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

  • 201 Posts
  • 32 Reply Likes
Cw signals
Photo of James Whiteway

James Whiteway

  • 1021 Posts
  • 288 Reply Likes
Working with my project has given me a greater appreciation of the work involved in getting the simplest things working correctly. That is one reason I don't complain about features either not working or not yet available in SSDR or any application that controls our SDR radios.
I hope your app sells like hotcakes!
james
WD5GWY
Photo of Al / NN4ZZ

Al / NN4ZZ

  • 1844 Posts
  • 669 Reply Likes
Hi Stu,
I understand about the effort, audience and ROI.  About a year ago Steve mentioned his idea for connecting a  paddle to both a laptop and a plan for the iPad.  I don't expect to see it anytime soon but maybe you can leverage whatever they develop.   The full thread is in the LINK below and the relevant post is pasted in below.   Initially I may just use the app to listen and move to my operating position for the QSO.  At any rate, looking forward to giving it a try. 

https://community.flexradio.com/flexradio/topics/remote_is_cw_via_a_paddle_in_scope_for_the_remote_e...

*********************************************************************************************

 Steve - N5AC, VP Engineering

Actually I do have a pretty good idea for how to do it. The real block is a belief that few are going to carry just a tablet and a paddle but not a PC. In other words, I don't believe that the group that says they "will carry a paddle everywhere they go, but will not buy/have a laptop and instead demand using a tablet" is a large group. If I'm wrong about that I'd like to know. Under the current thinking, if you want a paddle to operate, you would need a Windows device of some kind. So here are the operating scenarios we would plan to support with today's thinking: 

- desktop PC with a CW paddle (great for the lake house, across the house, DXpedition, etc) 
- laptop PC with a CW paddle (great for the road warrior if you want to carry a 5# BY-1 or suitable replacement) 
- iPad with keyboard CW for the person that wants to do CW from anywhere and is willing to use a keyboard (incidentally, we are not planning to do the iPad implementation directly, but imagine that partners will do this) 
- Surface with a CW paddle for the person willing to sacrifice ergonomics of operation because they want a tablet and a CW paddle on the road (again we have no plans to support the surface directly, but imagine that SmartSDR will run on this platform as it does today -- it a less that ergonomic ally preferable way) 

Our thinking today is that this will cover 98% of our customers' needs. We have a plan for hooking a CW paddle to an iPad, but suspect that few will want it -- the iPad purchase says the individual wants a lightweight convenient device to carry and a CW paddle doesn't seem to fit into that. If you have to have a paddle, our thinking is that you will get/have a lightweight PC you will carry along with the paddle. 

***********************************************************************************************

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
6700 - HW......... V 1.5.1.70
SSDR / DAX...... V 1.5.1.152
CAT................... V 1.5.1.0
Win10
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Al,

Technically there are several ways to do this but you didn't highlight the most important part of Steve's response:
... but suspect that few will want it -- the iPad purchase says the individual wants a lightweight convenient device to carry and a CW paddle doesn't seem to fit into that.
I'm not into subsistence engineering.

The use case for this is marginal at best and the volumes so low as to not warrant the effort.  I really hope FlexRadio doesn't spent its engineering efforts on a paddle for the iPad - I can think of so many other profitable ways of spending engineering effort that the paddle for the iPad doesn't pass muster.

Not much else to add to this part of the discussion.
Stu K6TU
Photo of Al / NN4ZZ

Al / NN4ZZ

  • 1844 Posts
  • 669 Reply Likes
Hi Stu,
I understand and Maestro also addresses at least some of the users that would want to use a paddle on a remote device.  Steve indicates they will address adding a paddle to the PC laptops and Surface tablet.  So my thought is that whatever that solution is might just "plug and play" on the iPad, at least from the hardware standpoint.  

For folks that travel with just an iPad and don't want to carry another device (Maestro or PC laptop or PC tablet))  it could still be of interest.    The iPad PRO looks like a serious tablet and over the next few years they will likely get even more powerful.

I'm not expecting anything soon (or maybe ever) but there might be more interest in the iPad paddle than we know.   Maybe down the road we could do a survey.....

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
6700 - HW......... V 1.5.1.70
SSDR / DAX...... V 1.5.1.152
CAT................... V 1.5.1.0
Win10
Photo of Jerry W4UK

Jerry W4UK

  • 44 Posts
  • 7 Reply Likes

You might not want the bulk/fragility of a conventional paddle, but what if a computer mouse + program could do the job???

Perhaps one of our clever programmers could write a program to convert mouse left/right clicks from our computer mouse into paddle  dot/dash contact closures.

It is probably easy to retrain your fingers. I remember reading that years ago, a guy rewired a computer mouse and made it into a paddle. Googling a few minutes ago showed me that many guys have made paddles this way. Some mobile cw with them.

I found one program that would have let me practice mouse paddling, but it had a virus so no go.

Jerry W4UK


Photo of Al / NN4ZZ

Al / NN4ZZ

  • 1844 Posts
  • 669 Reply Likes
Hi Jerry,
I don't have any problem using / carrying a USB attached paddle.   I think that is what Steve H was considering.   Bluetooth is another option.   The paddle itself can be quite small, here is just one example below.  There are many small paddles designed for portable use which are not any larger than a mouse or power supply.   I don't have any idea how many other CW OPs would also be interested in this but the size/weight/bulk/fragility of the paddle wouldn't be an issue for me.   When I carry my K2 around for portable use I have a whole lot more stuff to deal with than I would with an iPad and paddle. 

Mouse Code -- If a mouse left/right click could work then I'd expect a real paddle could also simulate an attached mouse.  I played with a program that used mouse clicks to generate CW and it didn't work very well.  I never really got the hang of the button latency but YMMV. 

As Stu mentioned this may be a long way off for FRS given all of the other things they probably have on their wish list.  And farther off for Stu's iPad app, we may never see if on the iPad but one can hope.

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
6700 - HW......... V 1.5.1.70
SSDR / DAX...... V 1.5.1.152
CAT................... V 1.5.1.0
Win10 


Photo of KD4HSO

KD4HSO

  • 53 Posts
  • 3 Reply Likes
How about on on-screen thumb based paddle; a region on the left and right of the screen. There is an iPhone based CW app that has this, and it works fairly well.
Photo of KD8TVB

KD8TVB

  • 49 Posts
  • 11 Reply Likes


iPad Pro, 128 Cell & wifi
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Apple has chosen to do something I don't understand with how views are mapped to the screen on the Pro.

I appreciate the screen shots and this confirms what I thought was happening.

I am in the process of getting a Pro.  Here is the heart of Yuppyland (Silicon Valley), the fanboys camped out over night to buy our all the Pro's in the local Apple stores - so there is a short delay in your regular programming until normal service is resumed.

Stu K6TU
Photo of KD8TVB

KD8TVB

  • 49 Posts
  • 11 Reply Likes
I must confess I got up at 4 am to order mine and it said pickup available... Thanks for your work.
Photo of Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

  • 201 Posts
  • 32 Reply Likes
Me too
Photo of Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

  • 201 Posts
  • 32 Reply Likes
Stu...I know good work is not CHEAP or FAST. I have one question about the process however. Does apple subject the app updates to the same time intensive checking or do the app updates process faster? Thanks for all of the good work and you will have a "small" revenue stream coming from me for a long time
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Lawrence,

Apple applies the same review process to each release of an app although from a developers point of view, the number of iterations to get an app through the review process can be "more than one" for a first release - that was the case for my Remote app.

Typically it takes 5-10 business days for an app to process through the queue after submittal before Apple begins the review process.  After the first approved release, the time in review is typically very short - an hour or so.  It then takes about a day for the app to be available throughout the App Stores around the world.

A developer can request an expedited review in the event that something gets seriously broken but makes it through the process.  Apple is clear that this is not to be used for regular releases so abusing that escape route would likely be "a bad idea" (tm).

Thank you for subscribing!  It's great feedback to show that the effort developing the app was well worth while!

Stu K6TU
Photo of Dale KB5VE

Dale KB5VE

  • 413 Posts
  • 56 Reply Likes
I don't have the latest and greatest iPad , but I do have a iPad 2 , and I down loaded just to see how it played, Stu it really amazed me how well it did audio and panDapter ok. I did see some lag at times when I moved something but overall ok. Now I do not plan on using the paid version but nice to play with. Most of my friends indicated the yearly ani up is not what they want to do. Keep up the work.
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Dave,

There is already a discount for yearly subscription versus the 30 day sub.  In the US, a 30 day subscription is $9.99 while the yearly is $99.99.  The subscription covers all upgrades issued during the subscription period at no extra cost.

Apple's subscription mechanisms do not provide a way of being able to offer renewal pricing at a different level than an initial subscription.

Stu K6TU
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Dale,

I was not throwing you under the bus or out with the bath water.

I appreciate you have a choice.  If the value for you isn't there with the app you have a clear and simple choice - don't purchase the subscription.

But then equally (since I have a choice too), don't take me to task with comments like:
Most of my friends indicated the yearly ani up is not what they want to do.
I appreciate that value is in the eye of the beholder and therefore the app isn't for everyone.

Simple choice - don't buy it.

More complex choice - don't complain about it.

Stu K6TU
Photo of Dale KB5VE

Dale KB5VE

  • 413 Posts
  • 56 Reply Likes

I will not go off here but i am sorry you took it that way. Believe me in my field if i took that comment so negatively I would never get anything done. As I tell people who feel what i have to offer is not priced right or doesnot meet the need i simply tell them I understand and I hope they find what they are looking for and if they dont I will still be here to help them.


Keep writing code you are very good at it. I a sure the rewards for you will be many.


Dale

KB5VE

Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
LOL!  I didn't take your comment negatively at all - but I live in a direct, fact driven world.  You made a statement:
Most of my friends indicated the yearly ani up is not what they want to do.
I responded to a statement you made but after this response, I will let you have the last word and get back to writing code.

73
Stu K6TU
Photo of Dale KB5VE

Dale KB5VE

  • 413 Posts
  • 56 Reply Likes
Ok the friends who have the 6000 series all 6500 but one that is right in all and myself . I could post calls but the numbers are it. I explained that Windows 10 is the same thing.

In fact flex started off with a vegetarian by the year and you saw how far that went I still have a free version update in the bag.

I am sure you have enough to buy it to make it worth your while and that is all that matters . Have a great day no hard feelings on my part. I have bought 5 of the flex knobs keep two on my desk at all times!
Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
I thought about not posting what follows below but I want to be very clear why I chose to make K6TU Remote available via subscription rather than a one time (and never free as in beer!) purchase.  I had written what follows below as a part of my response to a another comment in this thread but realized it was better as a standalone post and not a reply.

So here goes...

The iPad Pro is a great example of the costs associated with keeping an app current and why there are ongoing costs.  I have an Air2 which size and performance wise is great for me.  But now I will have to purchase an iPad Pro so that I can test my app with that hardware - that costs me real money, not just time.

Every time FlexRadio changes the software in the radio, I have to test and often make significant code changes in order to keep the app current with their software.  This takes time especially when I have to now test the app across multiple iPad versions.

Apple typically makes a major new release of iOS once a year.  Each OS change has to be tested and often requires application level changes as new functionality is added which folks expect to be able to access in an app or as functionality is removed.  Yes, Apple removes or changes interfaces that are necessary for an application to work.  This takes more time.

Last but not least, there is new functionality that I add in the app.

Consider this; I had dinner with some friends last night - my friends have a new car that is a 2016 version of mine.  Wow - does it have some cool new features!  Unfortunately, they aren't available as upgrades on my car.  Sure would have been nice to have a subscription that enabled me to get new functionality as my car ages.  The new features aren't worth (to me right now at least) the price of ordering a new car and having to eat "drive off the lot" depreciation but that's my choice.

I apologize for the length (but not content) of this response - I'm not (as the responder to one of my other posts suggested) throwing anyone under the bus.  There is a larger point here that I'm making.

Software development costs money.

Lots of money...  software developers especially for iPad applications are expensive.

If FlexRadio had to hire someone to write the remote app, I'm sure they would have analyzed the cost versus the revenue it would generate as a first upfront step.  They would have sighed and erased the idea of the app from their planning.  It simply makes ZERO economic sense - even considering the pull through they might generate from people who buy a radio because of the app.

Apart from a long career developing software and managing teams of developers building software that is massively deployed around the world, I'm a business guy and get faced with economic tradeoffs every day.  Developing any product requires understanding the size of the market for that product and what people will pay for it.  If the revenue you generate won't pay for the product development, its generally a rotten idea to pursue.

If we as users of the radio want useful capabilities that augment, streamline or complement our operating of the radio, we need to be prepared to pay for them.  This is doubly true for us as operators of FlexRadio 6000 series radios as in many cases, the capabilities ONLY work with a Flex 6000.  This is called a constrained market.

The revenue I generate from K6TU Remote will never provide a replacement for my day job (I'm not retired) and frankly as an app with its target market, doesn't represent the best use of my development time.  I could easily write apps that would generate a larger amount of revenue,

So I chose to make functionality available by subscription to make a point.

That point has now been well made and I can point to this post when answering other questions about costs, subscriptions, why-not-free (as in beer) in the future.

Thank you for reading and for the opportunity to make this important point.

Stu K6TU
Photo of K0UNX

K0UNX

  • 107 Posts
  • 30 Reply Likes
Personally, I would like to EXTEND A HEARTY THANK YOU to STU for his efforts!  I am subscribing to K6TU Remote, and feel that I'm getting my money's worth!

There will always be a few that feel that everything they want in life should be provided, just like Mommy and Daddy provided when we were children.  In recent years, we've seen people demanding all sorts of benefits from governments at all levels, as if governments are the source of all things, and that the governments owe it to us, just because we're so darned important.  We've seen governments default on their bonds as a result of that attitude.  I don't want to see software developers stop developing because they aren't rewarded for their efforts.  Stu is enriching my life, and I'm happy to pay for it.

I don't use "JUST" K6TU Remote.  I also use SSDR on my iMac, and DogParkSDR on my MacBook AIR, but the ability to take my iPad into the back yard, or to the breakfast table, OR UP THE TOWER WITH ME WHILE TUNING AN ANTENNA (which I'll be doing in about 2 hours) gives me LOTS OF FLEXIBILITY that I value.

That said, this thread must be very discouraging to STU and to the fine folks at DogPark.  I'd rather see them spend their time actually CODING, rather than defending the value of their efforts.

Jim Flannery
K0UNX
UNIXman@mac.com
Photo of Paul Christensen, W9AC

Paul Christensen, W9AC, Elmer

  • 323 Posts
  • 138 Reply Likes

I agree with Jim's comments.  K6TU is the master of his own offer; he need not secure approval from anyone.  Nor, is his pricing subject to a democratic process.  

Paul, W9AC


  

    



Photo of Stu Phillips - K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU, Elmer

  • 642 Posts
  • 256 Reply Likes
Jim,

Thanks for the kind words and I assure you, I'm not discouraged!

Having fun writing software the proves out to be useful!
Stu K6TU
Photo of KY6LA - Howard

KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

  • 3727 Posts
  • 1578 Reply Likes
Stu

Thank you for your BRILLIANT Program.

As you know I have already used it on my DXpeditions to remote back to my station in the USA with great success and I even had an interesting adventure being chased down the beach still in QSO using the iPad..

Your program is by far the easiest and most seamless way to remote from an iPad.

It's unfortunate that "Hams are Cheap" and somehow, while willing to pay $$$$ for hardware seem to expect all software to be free... even though the cost of software development can be many times higher than the cost of hardware....

The community needs to thank you for all your hard work...