K6TU Remote - release announcement V1.2

K0UNX

Stu, you're a champ!  I'm "lovin' it!"

SNAP tuning would really be super.  I'd suggest 500 Hz steps, since that's the standard for SSB "channelization."   Perhaps near the transmit button, labeled, 
- TUNE +
so we could just tap, landing exactly on a kHz mark or a .5 mark.

While tuning down at the bottom of the active frequency gives narrow tuning, I keep overshooting.  Maybe it is my age with a little shake setting in...
Jim
K0UNX

DK1EY

Can anyone recommend an external Mike/Headset and share the configuration?

Gary Robertson - KY5R

Like DK1EY, I would like to use an Headset/Mike with my iPad. Does it matter if the headset uses Bluetooth or the 3.5mm connection. Love the new IPad app!!!

Al_NN4ZZ

Hi Stu,
I pre-ordered an iPad Pro (wifi + cellular model) yesterday.   I'll be downloading your app when it gets here.   Since I'm CW only, I may wait until there is CW paddle support before upgrading to the full version.  Should look nice on the big pro screen....

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
6700 - HW......... V 1.5.1.70
SSDR / DAX...... V 1.5.1.152
CAT................... V 1.5.1.0
Win10  

Stu Phillips - K6TU

Al,

I have not yet tested the app on the Pro but it should work fine.  CW support with a paddle is a long way out.  The first release with CW will support an on-screen keyboard or a Bluetooth connected keyboard.

Adding a paddle will require special hardware (yet to be developed) - to be blunt, the market size for this is so small, I doubt it will get done - simply no return on the investment.

Folks don't understand the amount of effort required to give them everything they want.

Sin dinero = sin producto.

Pretty easy equation.
Sorry 
Stu K6TU

James Whiteway

Working with my project has given me a greater appreciation of the work involved in getting the simplest things working correctly. That is one reason I don't complain about features either not working or not yet available in SSDR or any application that controls our SDR radios.
I hope your app sells like hotcakes!
james
WD5GWY

Al_NN4ZZ

Hi Stu,
I understand about the effort, audience and ROI.  About a year ago Steve mentioned his idea for connecting a  paddle to both a laptop and a plan for the iPad.  I don't expect to see it anytime soon but maybe you can leverage whatever they develop.   The full thread is in the LINK below and the relevant post is pasted in below.   Initially I may just use the app to listen and move to my operating position for the QSO.  At any rate, looking forward to giving it a try. 

https://community.flexradio.com/flexradio/topics/remote_is_cw_via_a_paddle_in_scope_for_the_remote_e...

*********************************************************************************************

 Steve - N5AC, VP Engineering

Actually I do have a pretty good idea for how to do it. The real block is a belief that few are going to carry just a tablet and a paddle but not a PC. In other words, I don't believe that the group that says they "will carry a paddle everywhere they go, but will not buy/have a laptop and instead demand using a tablet" is a large group. If I'm wrong about that I'd like to know. Under the current thinking, if you want a paddle to operate, you would need a Windows device of some kind. So here are the operating scenarios we would plan to support with today's thinking: 

- desktop PC with a CW paddle (great for the lake house, across the house, DXpedition, etc) 
- laptop PC with a CW paddle (great for the road warrior if you want to carry a 5# BY-1 or suitable replacement) 
- iPad with keyboard CW for the person that wants to do CW from anywhere and is willing to use a keyboard (incidentally, we are not planning to do the iPad implementation directly, but imagine that partners will do this) 
- Surface with a CW paddle for the person willing to sacrifice ergonomics of operation because they want a tablet and a CW paddle on the road (again we have no plans to support the surface directly, but imagine that SmartSDR will run on this platform as it does today -- it a less that ergonomic ally preferable way) 

Our thinking today is that this will cover 98% of our customers' needs. We have a plan for hooking a CW paddle to an iPad, but suspect that few will want it -- the iPad purchase says the individual wants a lightweight convenient device to carry and a CW paddle doesn't seem to fit into that. If you have to have a paddle, our thinking is that you will get/have a lightweight PC you will carry along with the paddle. 

***********************************************************************************************

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
6700 - HW......... V 1.5.1.70
SSDR / DAX...... V 1.5.1.152
CAT................... V 1.5.1.0
Win10

Stu Phillips - K6TU

Al,

Technically there are several ways to do this but you didn't highlight the most important part of Steve's response:

... but suspect that few will want it -- the iPad purchase says the individual wants a lightweight convenient device to carry and a CW paddle doesn't seem to fit into that.

I'm not into subsistence engineering.

The use case for this is marginal at best and the volumes so low as to not warrant the effort.  I really hope FlexRadio doesn't spent its engineering efforts on a paddle for the iPad - I can think of so many other profitable ways of spending engineering effort that the paddle for the iPad doesn't pass muster.

Not much else to add to this part of the discussion.
Stu K6TU

Al_NN4ZZ

Hi Stu,
I understand and Maestro also addresses at least some of the users that would want to use a paddle on a remote device.  Steve indicates they will address adding a paddle to the PC laptops and Surface tablet.  So my thought is that whatever that solution is might just "plug and play" on the iPad, at least from the hardware standpoint.  

For folks that travel with just an iPad and don't want to carry another device (Maestro or PC laptop or PC tablet))  it could still be of interest.    The iPad PRO looks like a serious tablet and over the next few years they will likely get even more powerful.

I'm not expecting anything soon (or maybe ever) but there might be more interest in the iPad paddle than we know.   Maybe down the road we could do a survey.....

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
6700 - HW......... V 1.5.1.70
SSDR / DAX...... V 1.5.1.152
CAT................... V 1.5.1.0
Win10

Jerry W4UK

You might not want the bulk/fragility of a conventional paddle, but what if a computer mouse + program could do the job???

Perhaps one of our clever programmers could write a program to convert mouse left/right clicks from our computer mouse into paddle  dot/dash contact closures.

It is probably easy to retrain your fingers. I remember reading that years ago, a guy rewired a computer mouse and made it into a paddle. Googling a few minutes ago showed me that many guys have made paddles this way. Some mobile cw with them.

I found one program that would have let me practice mouse paddling, but it had a virus so no go.

Jerry W4UK

Al_NN4ZZ

Hi Jerry,
I don't have any problem using / carrying a USB attached paddle.   I think that is what Steve H was considering.   Bluetooth is another option.   The paddle itself can be quite small, here is just one example below.  There are many small paddles designed for portable use which are not any larger than a mouse or power supply.   I don't have any idea how many other CW OPs would also be interested in this but the size/weight/bulk/fragility of the paddle wouldn't be an issue for me.   When I carry my K2 around for portable use I have a whole lot more stuff to deal with than I would with an iPad and paddle. 

Mouse Code -- If a mouse left/right click could work then I'd expect a real paddle could also simulate an attached mouse.  I played with a program that used mouse clicks to generate CW and it didn't work very well.  I never really got the hang of the button latency but YMMV. 

As Stu mentioned this may be a long way off for FRS given all of the other things they probably have on their wish list.  And farther off for Stu's iPad app, we may never see if on the iPad but one can hope.

Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
6700 - HW......... V 1.5.1.70
SSDR / DAX...... V 1.5.1.152
CAT................... V 1.5.1.0
Win10 

David Decoons, wo2x

Good suggestions Paul. I concur.

Nice job Stu.!

Dave wo2x

Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

I understand keyboard / Bluetooth keyboard for sending but will there be any decoding of cow signals beside the operator themselves?

Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

Cw signals

David Decoons, wo2x

You can use the Apple lightning to USB cable and a Griffin iMIc. This allows headsets with separate 3.5 mm plugs for mic and headset. I am using a Heil Proset Elite with the IC element using the Lightning to USB and iMic. A little EQ adjustment and it works fine!

KD4HSO

How about on on-screen thumb based paddle; a region on the left and right of the screen. There is an iPhone based CW app that has this, and it works fairly well.

KD8TVB

iPad Pro, 128 Cell & wifi

KD8TVB

App does not scale to full screen, will let you know more in a few hours of use

Stu Phillips - K6TU

I have not had a Pro to be able to test the app.

Stu K6TU

KD8TVB

Come on over, I have good **** in the frig App is smooth, audio in the background is nice, seems faster than my air... I thought the app size was variable based on screen size, it is air sized in the upper left corner. I will snap some pics. KD8TVB

Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

Me too

KD8TVB

KD8TVB

KD8TVB

Dale KB5VE

I don't have the latest and greatest iPad , but I do have a iPad 2 , and I down loaded just to see how it played, Stu it really amazed me how well it did audio and panDapter ok. I did see some lag at times when I moved something but overall ok. Now I do not plan on using the paid version but nice to play with. Most of my friends indicated the yearly ani up is not what they want to do. Keep up the work.

Stu Phillips - K6TU

Dale,

Forgive me for being blunt but why do you assume that even a receive only version remains free (as in ****) for ever?

Very few hams have any understanding of the amount of work and ongoing effort it requires to keep software current and moving forward.  I don't do this for the money (iPad apps focused on FlexRadio is not a business) and even more bluntly, if I had not wanted the application for myself, there would have been ZERO incentive to develop it knowing the cheap nature of hams especially as it relates to software.

I chose to provide functionality via a subscription basis because its is the appropriate thing to do and to send a clear message that useful functionality does not come at a fixed price (and never for free).

We are fortunate to live in a world where our CHOICE is free - mine to charge a subscription and everyone else to choose whether to subscribe or not.

I spent considerable time early on in the app development to recover CPU cycles in the pursuit of making the older iPad's viable - but like free software, it turned out the effort was a fools errand.  There simply wasn't enough horse power in the older units to provide the level of user experience I wanted people to have.  The app will run with unbroken audio even on an iPad Mini 2 - whose processor doesn't generate enough heat to melt an ice cube.  But the user experience is not up to my standards/requirements.

It never ceases to amaze me that folks who spend thousands of dollars on a radio, at least the same again on computer equipment, not to mention any level of serious antenna/amplifier/etc, then balk at a $100/year for all the functionality that is released plus ongoing changes to track hardware, software and radio changes.

Y'all are going to get your boxers seriously wedged as all the software you use becomes available only with ongoing subscription/maintenance fees.

I guess folks can continue to use their 400 MHz Pentium running Windows ME with Office 95 - free choice - but not viable to do real work.

And the Luddite shall inherit the Buggy Whip...

Stu K6TU

Stu Phillips - K6TU

Apple has chosen to do something I don't understand with how views are mapped to the screen on the Pro.

I appreciate the screen shots and this confirms what I thought was happening.

I am in the process of getting a Pro.  Here is the heart of Yuppyland (Silicon Valley), the fanboys camped out over night to buy our all the Pro's in the local Apple stores - so there is a short delay in your regular programming until normal service is resumed.

Stu K6TU

KD8TVB

I must confess I got up at 4 am to order mine and it said pickup available... Thanks for your work.

Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

Me too

Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZB

Stu...I know good work is not CHEAP or FAST. I have one question about the process however. Does apple subject the app updates to the same time intensive checking or do the app updates process faster? Thanks for all of the good work and you will have a "small" revenue stream coming from me for a long time