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K6TU Remote - Sneak Preview

2

Comments

  • edited August 2016
    Dale,

    On remote from your truck using the VPN solution I described, the viability of this will depend on the bandwidth you can get from the iPad over its wireless data connection. The K6TU Remote app is getting about 1 MBps of data from the radio (audio and pan adaptor/waterfall etc) so its not a huge hog.  There is a version of the Broadband Speed Test that runs on the iPad/iPhone - if that shows you can get at least 3 MBps down and at least 1 MBps up, you should be able to get reasonable operation providing you aren't on the other side of the country from your station.

    The Wireless Data connectivity has considerably more latency than typical home broadband connections would experience and also suffers from considerably more lost data packets especially when you are in motion.

    I understand your comment about the likely requirements for which iPad will support the K6TU Remote App but the iPad 2 and iPad Mini are almost 10x slower than the latest Air 2.  Its not just a CPU issue but also one of how well the graphics subsystem performs.

    Here's a link that shows the performance comparison just as an example...

    https://browser.primatelabs.com/ios-benchmarks

    I'm very grateful to Chris K6OZY for sending me a link that I believe knocks over the problem of using the Mic button as a hard PTT - I have to sort this out but I'm optimistic I will.

    The FlexControl will not interface to the iPad as there isn't a native USB connection on the iPad.  I know there are some third party adaptors that might solve the problem but I haven't experimented with that.  You can however tune the slice by using finger gestures on the iPad - I'm working to make this easy to use.

    Stu K6TU
  • Dave KD5FXDave KD5FX Member ✭✭
    edited March 2017
    Looking forward to this! Let us know when it's ready to order!

  • Dale KB5VEDale KB5VE Member ✭✭
    edited July 2015
    Great I have loved the iPad 2 and have no problem using it at home and investing in a newer version based on what you recommend... I signed up for the new control station at daytonwith the desire to use it Mobil and portable but I have no desire for knobs so if your I pad app works I might just use that money to upgrade the iPad. I will check my band width on my iPhone and blackberry two different providers. Also I am not eat up with the panadapter in the Mobil. Will that being cut off help a lot on the bandwidth.
  • Dale KB5VEDale KB5VE Member ✭✭
    edited July 2015
    Ok stu just ran my blackberry which would be my first choice with connected to my ipad2 and I am getting 34 to 40 down and 9 to 10 up so I should be in good shap. How about the remote running on a iPhone 6 or 6 plus
  • k0eook0eoo Member ✭✭
    edited May 8
    Hi Stu, if this new app works as well as your last one I'll have to get on board too....  Do you think a 4th gen iPad with a benchmark of 768 would respond well enough?  Or can't you now yet?

    Dennis, k0eoo
  • edited August 2016
    Dennis, Still too soon to tell. I havent had enough time to evaluate the performance on different iPad models. All in time as I make progress. Sorry. Stu K6TU
  • WA6FXT MikeWA6FXT Mike Member
    edited September 2016

    Stu,


      Stop answering posts and get back to work, we're waiting (hihi).


    73's de Mike WA6FXT 

  • W9OYW9OY Alpha Team Member ✭✭
    edited May 8
    I hate the business philosophy of Apple but your app is intriguing enough that I bought an iPAD on Friday to see how it works.

      W9OY
  • edited August 2016
    Lee,

    I used to have a similar view but Apple does a lot for the App developer - they sell and protect the digital asset.  That's worth a fair chunk of the 30% they take off the top.  The real challenge with niche apps (and markets) like ones for FlexRadio is the approach to marketing.

    Marketing awareness is critical but the market size for Apps like K6TU Remote is small enough that conventional marketing is simply cost prohibitive.

    I hope folks will hold off on purchases (if they don't already have an iPad) until I can calibrate exactly what horsepower is needed.

    Right now its very unlikely that the app will run acceptably on iPad Minis or some of the older iPads...  I am gathering data on this as I have a group of 25 folks engaged in the alpha testing - across quite a range of devices.

    Stu K6TU
  • Lee - N2LEELee - N2LEE Member
    edited December 2016
    Lee, Apple has done more to bring innovative products to market than just about any other company. They have a vision and they follow that vision and philosophy. 

    Read a book by Ken Segall called "Insanely Simple" and you might come away with a better understanding of why they do what they do. 

    http://kensegall.com/insanely-simple-book/
  • W9OYW9OY Alpha Team Member ✭✭
    edited September 2015
    Stu
    I found an iPAD 4 64 with retina for $150 on craigslist so couldn't pass it up.  Worst that can happen is I use it for your other app, give it to my daughter, or watch a movie (like I have time to watch a movie).  I mostly want something I can check the bands while in my gym at the other end of the house or out on the patio, or turn on "tune" when at the antenna 

    Lee
    As far as "Simple" goes wintel had the same philosophy back in the 80-90's, slowly increase the horsepower and sell a new generation of slightly better hardware/software every year.  It's a marketing scheme not brilliance.  Brilliance would have been going to parallel processing in the MAC 30 years ago.

    73

  • Lee - N2LEELee - N2LEE Member
    edited December 2016
    Lee, sorry I don't understand your point. Apple's philosophy is to make better products that are easy to use and designed for those that appreciate quality. If I understand your point about "power" then this indicates you are not familiar with the Mac OS architecture.  Windows is bloatware and requires a lot more resources than the OS X. Because Apple has an integrated hardware & software platform and runs on a Unix based system it doesn't suffer from the problems Windows has had for decades. 

    It sounds like you are caught up on speeds and feeds and hardware. That is left over Intel marketing hype from 286, 386, 486, etc. You can't compare hardware for hardware because OS X is so much more efficient and requires a lot less memory, disk space and CPU than windows.

    I could list dozens of Apple innovations but this is not the place to have a the Apple / Windows debate.

  • K6OZYK6OZY Member
    edited February 2017
    With Stu's permission,  I have made a few videos.   Please note that the issues with the screen responding to my fingers were because of the dryness here in AZ.  After I recorded these,  I moistened them a bit with lotion, and it worked fine.  I need more aloe care!

    This first video is to show the extreme sides of available iPads.





    I'm hoping to record a few more, but so far I'm super impressed.
  • Robert -- N5IKDRobert -- N5IKD Member ✭✭
    edited May 8
    The word on the street (third-hand) at Summerfest was that this app was still at least a year out.

    I understand that you don't want to offer a definitive date because someone will take it as golden. I would like to hear your response to this rumor and maybe some updated videos.
  • edited August 2016
    I am working to get the app in the App Store before the end of this year (2015) and have 25 folks alpha testing the software, QSO's being made with the app and with regular app updates.

    Back to coding...
    Stu K6TU
  • Steve W6SDMSteve W6SDM Member ✭✭
    edited August 2015
    Hmmm... I think I saw it in Vegas this weekend being demo'ed by Elvis.  :)
  • N3NERN3NER Member
    edited May 8
    This has my attention!  Will this work on a iphone as well?
  • edited August 2016
    No.

    Designing for an even smaller screen isn't a challenge I'm up for at the moment. Designing a touch driven interface to the radio and getting a clean, uncluttered display that is intuitive to use is presenting its own set of challenges which are slowly being worked through.

    Although the screen resolution is comparable, the amount of screen real estate required for accurate touch of a control requires that the control is physically larger requiring a different layout/control presentment design.

    The iPad mini has a similar but not as bad issue... the best experience is on the regular sized iPad.

    Also to note... the app is processing a lot of data - dealing with 24 frames a second of a pan adaptor, waterfall updates and remote audio is almost 2 Mbits/second.  The later iPads like the Air2 handle this without even heavy breathing or sweating... the older model iPads don't have anywhere near the processing capabilities of the later units.

    Still TBD which models of iPad will be supported by the app.

    Stu K6TU
  • edited August 2016
    Indeed!  Elvis was the first on the K6TU Remote alpha test list.

    Stu K6TU
  • N3NERN3NER Member
    edited December 2016
    Ok, thanks much!  I guess I'm going to sell my winpad and get an ipad. What versions of the ipad do you feel is best to run with this app?
  • edited August 2016
    "Still TBD which models of iPad will be supported by the app."

    Sorry - but I don't have a definitive answer for you at this point.
    Stu K6TU
  • Al_NN4ZZAl_NN4ZZ Loganville GAMember ✭✭✭
    edited December 2016
    And the new iPad PRO ( 12.9" screen) is due out around November.   Might be a good choice.

    http://www.macrumors.com/roundup/ipad-pro/

    Regards, Al / NN4ZZ  
    al (at) nn4zz (dot) com
  • Jon_KF2EJon_KF2E Member ✭✭
    edited May 8
    Hi Stu,

    I'm really looking forward to your app. I guess I will wait until the app is out to decide on an upgrade for my gen 3 iPad. 

    I'm curious how you plan to handle updates? Will they be included or will it be like SSDR and require paid upgrades at some interval?

    Jon...kf2e

  • Joe - KC2TNJoe - KC2TN Member ✭✭
    edited May 8
    I see you're tuning the Steppir in the background, any thought to implementing a rotor control for possibly selecting any one of 8 compass points?
  • edited August 2016
    I have not yet made a decision regarding this.  Part of the answer requires me understanding Apple's own requirements regarding app licensing.

    Stu K6TU
  • edited August 2016
    I'm currently using DDUtil to handle the background station automation tasks - it runs on a separate computer right next to my radio, amps etc.

    Station automation is indeed an area that must be addressed for remote operation of anything beyond the "boy and his radio" station.

    This won't be addressed in the first release but is the topic for the second release.

    Stu K6TU
  • k0eook0eoo Member ✭✭
    edited December 2016
    Yes, DDClient works very well on the remote PC along with SSDR....  Wish DDClient would echo the watt meter so I could verify power and SWR remotely with AMP on....

    Dennis, k0eoo
  • Lawrence Kellar KB5ZZBLawrence Kellar KB5ZZB Member ✭✭
    edited May 8
    Will the new iPad pro be supported? Thanks
  • edited August 2016
    If y'all club together to buy me one on which to test - sure! ;-)

    Seriously - it should run the app fine although likely not in two app mode under iOS9. K6TU Remote only supports operation in landscape mode and you can only run two apps in portrait mode.

    I have not yet tested the app under iOS9 but that is on the list of things to do and to make whatever changes are needed for the app to run.

    The iPad Pro reportedly has 2x the performance of the iPad Air 2 so it will sing!  

    As a note, I do intend to restrict the iPad app to require at least an iPad Air because of the performance requirements.  The older iPads are just not up to the job of running an app this demanding.

    So for best results, an iPad Air 2 or more recent is recommended.  An IPad Air or more recent will be required.  Apple will not show the app in the AppStore to devices before the iPad Air.

    Stu K6TU
  • K6OZYK6OZY Member
    edited September 2015
    As a note, the new iPad Mini 4 has the same guts of the iPad Air 2.  This means that is now a viable option for Stu's app.

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