Update ?????????

FRED W9TB

When are we going to get another update?  It has been some time now !

Bill -VA3WTB

Of course you won't get an answer to that question as we all know. but like you I am hoping it is soon as well.

k3Tim

"When you can **** the pebble from my hand, it will be time... grasshopper"

KC2QMA_John

"We will not update your radio before it's time"
I hope I will still be alive when it happens
Oh and I hope Auto Save will have an On/Off switch too.:( 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5C6EwLTAvHc

Neal Pollack, N6YFM

About a year ago, Flex was still a relatively small company with a handful of local and remote employees.   Recently, they received a reasonable size GOV contract for Airforce radios.
A person has to wonder if they have redirected most of their engineering team to work that
contract?   It is not like they had surplus employee time sitting around, they were barely
keeping up with the ham work last year.   Now, with the new contract, it is not like they could suddenly double their employee workforce size and have everyone ramped up and running.   In the beginning of a contract, you don't get a bunch of money up front.   But you would have to hire a bunch of people up front.   But those new people take time to learn and grow, so they are not productive right away.

So most likely, a fair bit of the focus this year for existing Flex employees is getting that GOV contract moving.  They are probably hoping to get back to the ham / SmartSDR work later.

As a person who works in AeroSpace, I can say that the pace usually does not settle down.
These contracts can require intense work and focus for a couple of years.
I hope later actually comes for the ham stuff :-)

This point in the growth of a small company is critical.   You don't get paid on a GOV contract
up front, but only for interim delivery milestones.   Yet, it takes a huge bunch of effort ($$$$) to get to
those milestones.   All, while trying to keep your existing customer base happy.

And the cost of the engineering for these contracts is approx  5 to 10x what it is for consumer products. You have to do extensive testing for each part, and extensive documentation for each part.
You don't simply order from digikey or mouser and start assembling.    You have to provide the customer with vibration testing, thermal cycling, system analysis, timing analysis, interference and EMP analysis and testing, and many many other tests that you would never even think of.  For a system similar  to  a Flex 6600, it would likely be far north of 2500 pages of test reports, circuit analysis, etc, etc.

This is the magical pivot point where a company either doubles in size successfully,
Or dies trying.

Bill -VA3WTB

Here are some things we do know. Fact's.
1) The radio sales were through the roof last year breaking sales records and sales are still very brisk.
2)This latest government contract is just one of many Flex has had in many years.
3) While under a contract Flex developed direct sampling radios for the government and that technology is how the 6000 radios were born.
4) While in a government contract Flex produced new radios, 6400M, 6600M, 6400, 6600, and an industry leading power amp.
5) While in contracts Flex has continued their usual SSDR upgrades, about 4 per year, along with a critical  update two weeks after the main update was released.
6) None of us know anything about the inner workings of Flex business. Other than what Gerald has shared with us.

Considering the history I just mentioned, why do some people think this is any different? Yes I am sure that Gerald and company have and will have growing pains and many internal things to manage. But this is not anything new for Gerald, he has been involved in other companies as well.

Neal Pollack, N6YFM

Hi Bill:

I can't resist :-)
But in your reply, the only facts that I can see are #2, and #6.
Unless you are an employee, you don't know the answer to the others.

My point as a very happy Flex customer was, and can be distilled down to;
If Flex had rapidly climbing sales, OR if Flex just started a GOV contract (Raytheon),
OR BOTH, then it will be a pivital and testing time.  Not just for Flex, but for any small
company in a similar situation.   It means pumping in massive amounts of $CASH$,
but BEFORE you get paid (which can come much later).

It was, and is, only an observation.   Not something you need to get defensive about :-)
You can't possibly call #1 (sales) a fact, unless you are an employee and have numbers.
Likewise, you have no way of knowing if Flex was still working on a contract at the time
of your #4 and #5 statements.

The only factual thing at all is that it sounds like you misinterpreted this as an attack,
and as an employee or wanna-be, felt you had to defend them.   
YOU DON'T.   They do just fine on their own :-)

Cheers,

Neal

Bill -VA3WTB

Yes they are all facts, Many of these facts seem to surprise you. All of my statements are taken from information shared by Gerald, or employees. I have no intention of attacking anyone, Notice your name was never mentioned? You are the one being defensive. I have no interest in defending Flex, just keeping things in perspective.

Neal Pollack, N6YFM

OK. :-)
Varried perspectives and viewpoints and observations.
Thanks Bill.

Cheers

Bill -VA3WTB

 Neal,,It's ok. I remember a time ago someone asked Gerald about contracts they had. Gerald chronologically mentioned them with start and ending dates for each contract, for example. I know my comment is true about contracts but without really studding the time lines of each it is possible that they may not have been in a contract at some point. I think you sort of mentioned that, thanks.

My fact list is really a carry over from a post I did a few weeks ago were some people were wondering if the new contract would **** off any new ham radio development. I was actually referring to any such notions,,not directly to you, sorry it seemed that way.

Tim - W4TME

Fred, we are continuously working on SmartSDR.  

There are quality and other process thresholds that have to be met before we do a software release.  Because this is a very dynamic and fluid process, and so that customer expectations are met with a high degree of accuracy, we no longer "time box" a release, meaning that we have no longer state a specific date or even a date range for a new software release.

What we do is work on a new release, adding features and bug fixes until the team feels that the release is substantial enough and the quality is achieving high enough threshold levels to go to final testing.  It is at this point when as have a high level of confidence that the release is imminent that our marketing and sales teams begin to discuss the upcoming release.  Until that time, we do not provide any public updates as to when a new software release will be made available.

KC2QMA_John

What was the date if the last software update?
Today is 02/18/2020.

Neil D Friedman N3DF

I upload SSDR updates pretty rapidly after release and I uploaded 3.1.8 on 4 October 2019.  

Neal Pollack, N6YFM

3.1.8 Release notes are dated October 4, 2019.

That makes the current release approx 4.5 months old.   Not bad, but not
precisely 4 releases a year.  But hey,  I have worked in Software MFG, and
I can tell you, it does NOT always work out to precise schedules.  You want
to ship when a release is READY, not when a timer expires and it might not
be ready for customers (do I hear the cell phone industry? :-)  )

Cheers

Joe N3HEE

One or two substantial releases per year that provide new or improved features and bug fixes that actually work correctly and not break previously released features and introduce new bugs would be far better.  Flex should take more time and concentrate on improving the quality of their releases. 

Bill -VA3WTB

so maybe only release once a year is what your thinking?

KC2QMA_John

How about once every 5 years, what do you think Bill?

Geoff AB6BT

How about no schedule with releases when they are ready and tested?

That way no unreasonable expectations.

Bill -VA3WTB

Lol,,, ok ok... even at once a year, could you imagine the back lash. many people think aprox 4 times a year is out rages.

Geoff AB6BT

Again, unreasonable expectations rear their ugly head...

Perhaps the 737 MAX should have been back in the air based on some mythical expectations?

KC2QMA_John

I could be wrong and I hope I am but by the time SmartSDR gets to be more reliable and feature rich like users expect another competitor may like Apache Labs or Elecraft may have just what the market demands. Then add that to the fact that currently FlexRadio is understaffed and has to meet new deadlines for its new contract client Raytheon you can see why SmartSDR and some of the other Amateur radio products may have to take a back seat.

The 6000 series and Maestro are fine products but I feel that they are being held back due to the software. What flex has done with SSDR is great so far but it has a long way to go before it really takes advantage of the powerful 6000 series hardware.

I’m keeping my fingers crossed with the hope that we will start to see SSDR really take off.

Joe N3HEE

You guys are missing the point.  No schedule.  No expectations.  Just fewer (one two, whatever) high QUALITY releases per year. Flex would reduce user frustration and support time in the long run.

Just look at how much effort is spent by users trying to get operational again after a busted upgrade.  Multiply that times four times a year.  Why ! ?

Who gauges or makes buying decisions based on the number of releases Flex puts out per year ?  However, poor quality upgrades will tend to drive people away.

I would be much happier and willing to wait for an update.  I would EXPECT that when an update is released it is substantial in nature and it WORKS without introducing bugs or crippling existing features and I am operational within minutes with nice new features

I'm not excited anymore when a new release comes out.  Needless to say I'm running 2.5.1 which is the lesser of two evils right now.  I don't have the time to fool around four times a year with getting the radio to work properly again.

Rant over.

Joe N3HEE

What John says exactly !

Bill -VA3WTB

I see your point John.
I will make a few points here.
I think SSDR is very stable. It always work each day the same as the last day.
If we were to take out a pen and paper and write down all the features other radios have, then write all the features Flex has, I think they will closely balance out.
Keeping in mind there are a few features Flex has that no other radio has.

If you were to revert back to the very first SSDR release we would see just how far SSDR has come. As Flex releases around 4 updates a year, I really don't see SSDR taking off any more than it is now.

I hear you a and others suggest that Flex is very understaffed causing their products to take a back seat. But their is simply no evidence to support that.

Rich McCabe

Totally agree with you Joe.

But I will say in regards to your comment "Who gauges or makes buying decisions based on the number of releases Flex puts out per year ? " 

I certainly would base my buying decision on that if I felt there was another competitor that built a radio that would meet my needs like Flex does.  I am spoiled by having a computer interface  with DAX and CAT where I don't need physical cables for audio and data and there is nothing else out there that compares for me.

I equate releases to new radios. I like new radios

For my needs Flex has released very few things since V1 that has really excited me so its been a pretty lackluster journey. But in the end for me there are no other options. Great radio! Just want more.

Rich

HCampbell WB4IVF

My guess is that the main reason for no recent releases is that they are busy implementing/testing last summer’s user survey top priorities (which are not trivial tasks), as they said they would.

Howard

Bill -VA3WTB

Joe, I don't consider you ranting.
What your complaining about is simply the very nature of creating software, and very complicated software at that. No amount of time or test will solve every bug. Also can you please consider that A flex radio is capable of doing so many things there are hundreds of operating conditions that need testing. It is very possible that in some cases an operating condition may get overlooked. Lets say a few testers are concentrating on a few things that they are trying to nail down and they miss something that you and I would say, what? how could they miss that? it happens!

Flex has had the policy of no time line or expectations for a long time now. Ever since they stopped the time line version chart years ago.

Now they only release an update when they feel it is ready, and that can be anytime!! Most of us can argue weather or not a release is ready or not but none of us have any skin in the game, we don't run the company. They decide what is best for the company.

My recommendation? just enjoy our radios as we have them. I is not worth being so frustrated.

Bill -VA3WTB

HC,, not that this coming release is late, because it's not. I think your on to something there..lol