Sharing my Flex-6500 using Smart SDR v3.0.19

KY6LA_Howard

Money is easy to replace. Good friends are not that easy. To find

KY6LA_Howard

@Pat I am an engineer. I have built complex systems all over the world since the early 60’s. The hardest part of working on Innovative systems is fighting negativity.

Pat N6PAT

Hey that's great.

I've found that while designing a system focusing on the potential pitfalls of each element allows me to address them during the design phase rather than having to address them after implementation at additional cost.

Bill -VA3WTB

I agree Pat, but as I think about it, there really is not anything anyone could do to harm my radio remotely. so the aspect of someone damaging your radio is not likely.

Pat N6PAT

How would that work with an older tube amp that must be re-tuned manually?  It's pretty easy to damage that type of amp

David Decoons, wo2x

They NEED to download and use the same version loaded in the radio. There is no cost to download SmartSDR 3.0 for Windows. 

There IS a charge, for radios purchased prior to 10/1/18, to upgrade the actual radio to 3.0 or newer.

Bill -VA3WTB

Yes that is the only thing I can think of,,this is the reason my amp is off line when it is being used bye a freind,,other than that they can do what ever they please.

Pat N6PAT

So the remote user can only operate at low power for your configuration?

Bill -VA3WTB

Yes 100w, my amp is an tube amp.

David Decoons, wo2x

I will NOT allow anybody use my radio unless I explicitly trust them.

It is a very short list :-)

 Trying to talk my friend in Hawaii to upgrade his Flex 5000A to a 6600. He's been playing earlier via MultiFlex.

Dave wo2x

Pat N6PAT

Well that brings to mind any other EQ that might need to be handled manually such as a manual tuner. That would come into play regardless of the power level.

Bill -VA3WTB

Good thing is..this freind knows what he is doing, but because my station is not fully automated I have to have some things off as he can't adjust everything. But he uses my on board ant tuner.

Pat N6PAT

I'm just trying to understand what conditions you would need to allow a remote user to fully operate your station. You would have to eliminate all manual tasks (coax switches, tuners, amp, etc.)

Pat N6PAT

Would they be able to operate your antenna rotator remotely?

Bill -VA3WTB

Here in my shack it's simple, I have the amp off and my outboard tuner set to direct. He can only use the bands my antenna can work on and he understands that.

This is why I said before, it needs to be someone you can trust and understands conditions in your shack. But sharing can be a safe thing to do.

I am using a dipole antenna.

Pat N6PAT

Agreed. It can be done safely if you cover all bases. Pretty much everything has to be automatic or controllable remotely. Basically a fully automated shack

Bill -VA3WTB

My setup here is not the best, The guy that uses my radio is an elderly man in a retirement home, But he is thrilled just being able to get on the radio on 40m. And I'm glad I can share this with him.

David Decoons, wo2x

Hi Pat,

My setup has a solid state amp that tracks radio frequency via USB cable to the back of the radio so automatic bandswitching. In SmartSDR v3 there is a new TX persistence table where you can enter settings for all the bands in one place (power out, TX1, 2, 3, TX Inhibit, etc) 

I also have an auto antenna tuner which follows frequency direct from radio USB. 

Antennas are switched using a USB to BIT cable that drives a SainSmart USB8 board. That in turn drives my 1x4 antenna switch for automatic antenna switching.

So my friend in Hawaii has been bouncing between 17, 20 and 40 meters today and everything was switching fine.

I may spring for a 4O3A 2x8 antenna switch so I can have a second client running on a different antenna than the first.

Hopefully this gives you some insight as how you can set up a station for remote or MultiFlex operation.

73
Dave wo2x

David Decoons, wo2x

Pat, forgot to mention, I use PST Rotator to control my HF Yagi and it has a built in web server. My friend can bring up a web page to enter beam headings directly and there are preconfigured azimuth buttons. I use a non-standard port for the web server.

Also I have a network power distribution that again uses a non-standard port and is password protected. He can switch the amp & radio on or off, DC supply, rotator, etc.

Dave wo2x

Pat N6PAT

But how would you both control the rotator at the same time? How would you prevent the remote user changing antenna direction while you are using it?

Also, if you are on one band and the remote user is on another wouldn't that force your tuner to retune almost non stop?

David Decoons, wo2x

Best thing to do is use something like Slack to coordinate between remote users. 

Dave wo2x

Pat N6PAT

Yes. It's almost as if you have to limit the operations to one operator at a time.

KY6LA_Howard

@Pat I have running my 6700. SteppIR Monstir, Rotor and 2K-FA remotely for years Yes I have all sorts of backup systems and remote reboots for everything as well as dual homed internet. Pretty close to 99.99% uptime. Sharing it is not a major issue. As I said it’s usually one of the Flex Show Demo systems that the public can play with. For the most part it’s totally automated even with two clients albeit I have profiles to use separate antennas. I really do not understand your continual negativity. On The Other Hand I have successfully fought such negativity for years when designing and building systems. Life is much better with a positive can attitude.

Pat N6PAT

You 're confusing genuine curiosity. with continual negativity

I'm attempting to understand how allowing remote users to use your radio while you are using it applies to shacks that are not (or even if they are) fully automated.

If two ops are on different bands it seems to me to be unworkable for anyone that has a manually tuned amp or tuner. Even an auto tuner would go crazy constantly re-tuning between bands. How does that work?

How do you share an antenna rotator or an antenna switching unit?

Why do you label these kinds of questions as being negative? I'm really surprised no one has asked them before

David Decoons, wo2x

I think what it comes down to Pat is knowing what the limitations of the station are. For example, a Flex 6600, PGXL, 4O3A 2x8 switch, resonant antennas and proper isolation between antennas allows two people to be on two different bands at the same time. If you have multiple towers and separate Yagis for each band then each can have their own rotor control. Now dumb down a station where there is only one auto tuner for non resonant antennas then the users need to know the limitations (amount of time for tuning when switching bands, etc). That is where the station owner needs to lay down ground rules before handing over SmartLink credentials. You do bring up good points that thought and education needs to come into play before letting someone use your station remotely. (Or even when they are visiting and in front of the radio). Dave

Rich McCabe

Joe, Be curious if this is the case. I would like a guest login

Pat N6PAT

I agree. It almost seems that to take full advantage of V3 you need as you said "PGXL, 4O3A 2x8 switch, resonant antennas" etc, Those are very expensive toys.

Certainly it can work without all that but it places considerable restrictions on how you operate.

If you have a manual amp and/or tuner then you have to be present whenever someone wants to remote in. You also would not be able to operate at the same time on a different band without constantly re-tuning.

That's all I'm talking about. These are questions regarding limitations that should be asked yet I am accused of being negative.

Bill -VA3WTB

Pat,,,All good questions you asked. All this is just part of sharing a radio in the way we can now. limitations for some and none for some, all depends.

It will be interesting what things people will come up with in the future, this is just the begining of a technology in ham radio.

I read yesterday were a few members said that V3 is a god send for them because sometimes they forget to close SSDR down at home then find that they can't log in at the office because the radio is busy. Not a problem now,,can leave SSDR running at home and log in anytime. It's things like that that makes this so nice.

KY6LA_Howard

@Pat I normally run,on 20M/40M AT THE SAME TIME. on my 6700. Both Antennas are resonant so no tuner Isolation is very good. 2K-FA Amp is usually on 20M. Solid state. Albeit electronic ally switchable between bands. PSTROTATOR web app. Station has been remoted since 2011. Over the years I have added significant redundancy so the station is pretty well bulletproof. Been used as a Flex remote demo station for 2+ year. So far none of the “Great Unwashed” has yet to break anything. Hence no issues sharing with friends.

Pat N6PAT

That's good to know.

But what about the ops that use older hardware in conjunction with a Flex V3? Not everyone can pony up the coin for a PGXL.  .

For example - Bill mentioned that he has to shut down his tube amp in order to allow a remote op to use his radio and limit the remote op to just 100 watts.  Of course he is also limiting himself to 100 watts if he's using the radio at the same time.

When I bring these questions up you accuse me of being negative. I'm just trying to understand exactly how V3 will play out.

And who are the "Great Unwashed" you are referring to if you don't mind me asking?