Power Genius XL 220 Breaker Size

Ray - K6LJ

Installing 220 outlet for Power Genius. Have noted from forum that max load is 20 amps @ 220V. What breaker size should be used? 20 amp? 25 amp.

David-N5PSM

2kW capable x2 is 4 kW load at 220V RMS PF1.0 give 18A so you would be good with a 20A breaker.  However I do not know if there is any "inrush" current (Demagnetization of the transformer)   >>>Can someone else comment on that? <<<  Also I would use a GFI Breaker to protect against any isolation breakdown.   73 n5psm

Ray - K6LJ

Thank You

Frank WA3NHK

1. I think a 20A load calls for a breaker larger than 20A.  I believe breakers will trip on a sustained load of 85% of the rated capacity.
2. A 25 amp breaker should be minimally sufficient, but remember the breaker is there to protect the branch circuit wiring and not the appliance.  The amplifier should have internal fusing to protect itself.
3. Consult a wiring table in the NEC handbook or an equally qualified data source in order to select the minimum wire gauge consistent with your branch circuit wiring run and acceptable voltage drop.  No smaller than #12 for even the shortest run.

73.....Frank

N4MGA - Don

I have used a 30 amp Breaker with #10 Gauge house wiring for my amplifiers and it has a minimal Voltage drop at Peak Power which does make a difference!  If you undersize the wiring at longer lengths you will see the voltage dropping at the amplifier AC input!. ( It's Important to check the voltage drop at full power with any amplifier!) The 30 amp Breaker and #10GA wiring should only go to the Amplifier  with no other appliances or equipment connected.

73's 
Don
N4MGA

Clay N9IO

20 amp and 12ga wire, I ran an independent conduit run and 12ga thhn plus 3 120v runs for everything else in the shack.
Always put the burden on the breaker NOT the wire, the NEC rules are there to protect you from fire. Just read Don's post, totally agree, if the run is long or the 10 ga is a much better choice but I still say 20amp breaker, the breaker should be the first to go...

David-N5PSM

I agree with you Frank WA3NHK

Chris DL5NAM

First you have to check what fuse or breaker you have before. Your new breaker must be minimum one step lower

Ray - K6LJ

Hi Clay - Thanks. The electrician I had come in today used the code 12ga for 20 amp. I used a feed from an outlet box originally set up for a hot tub. In the house it has a 60 amp breaker and 4ga wires to the outlet box. the electrician replaced the outlet box and put a 20 amp breaker and used 12 ga to run 15 feet into my shack. The voltage measured at the outlet box is 247V. within the limit of 90 to 250v. In the shack the single plug is rated for 20 amps (the only load). I believe I will be ok as I work mostly SSB and will not be driving full power very often or at all. Appreciate the help. Here is the table for amps vs wire size.

The only thing to find out now is what the AWG is of the power cord from the amp.

Thanks

Brad A. Steffler

I  have an AL-82 on its own 240 V  circuit. The electrician installed a 30 amp breaker at the box, about 25 feet away. The wiring is 8 guage, 3 wire, looks as large as that for a 300 amp welder, used for welding steel girders. The amp has its own fuses. I will use this circuit for my PG-XL. Obviously, the AL-82 will be unplugged and will be for a back up. Eventually, I will probably sell it. As I understand it, the purpose of the breaker is to protect the wiring, the box and the house. The amp should have its own fusing for its own protection. It would be unwise to build an amp and not add internal over current protection to it by fusing the power supply, at the very least.

I, and my electrician, believe in a margin of safety.


Brad
KE4XJ

Clay N9IO

You'll be fine Ray, don't baby that amp it will work great for you.

NEMA 6-20R receptacle and NEMA 6-20P Plug.

I had two amps some years back and installed a dual 6-20R receptacle
with two separate 220v wire pairs (I broke out the center connecting bars)
but later I went to one amp, an Acom 1000 so I changed to a dual voltage
NEMA 6-20R and NEMA 5-20R 120v receptacle, that gave me an extra 120v circuit for the shack.  The only reason I mention this is that both of these dual receptacles use a standard duplex cover, no need to purchase the more expensive round twist covers or single outlet receptacles and they are available everywhere locally.

You're off to a great start, good luck with the new amp when it arrives.  I have a couple of friends in the same wait mode as you everyone is anxious.

73' Clay N9IO

HCampbell WB4IVF

The PG-XL uses C13/C14 sockets/plugs on the amp side.  I believe these are rated at 15A.  Since the amp will be the only appliance connected to our 240V circuit, at one time I considered replacing my 20A breaker with a 15A for that reason.  But I decided to stay with the 20A since (as has been noted here) the amp should have its own internal protection.  

Howard

Chris DL5NAM

Howard, have a look in user guide (you will found at 4o3a.com and you will see:


... and that is not a C13 / C14

And since 4. May PA  delivery has started!

[Deleted User]

That is a 240v 20A plug just like what is on my Palstar LA-1K

HCampbell WB4IVF

Some of the pictures on the 4O3A site are renderings I believe.  Ria confirmed that PG-XL uses a C13 connector:

https://community.flexradio.com/flexradio/topics/power-genius-xl-power-connector

and said that she uses this cord:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0093WFT5C/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

which has C13 and 6-20P connectors. 

Howard

David-N5PSM

Then he is on T&M  :-)

HCampbell WB4IVF

I bought this cord since my amp will be placed 12+ feet from the wall socket:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00H7HA5M2/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

Tim - W4TME

Ray - a 15 amp breaker on a 220V circuit will work, I'd recommend a 20 amp.

N4MGA - Don

Tim - What is the Gauge of the Wire in the PGXL Power Cord?  I expect 12 Gauge or larger.

Tim - W4TME

I believe it is 14 AWG stranded.  Rated for 15 amps continuous service

Ray - K6LJ

Hi Tim, Thanks I have installed a 20 amp breaker and 12 awg. wire to the plug. Now all I need is the Amp!!!. As I look at it with the 220 power there is actually 2 breakers each handling half the power. At 220 it is about 9 amps each I think. My line voltage is 247 which brings the current down to ~8 amps each. So I guess the 15 amp cable will work. This kind of info should be included in the brochure. If the amps are now shipping is the manual available?  Would be nice to read and dream.

Chris DL5NAM

http://www.4o3a.com/wp-content/uploads/filebase/pgxl/documentation/PGXL-User-Guide.pdf

Ray - K6LJ

Thank you Chris. Wonder why it has not been added to the FRS download site. It is needed for sure. Looks like it has been around for awhile.

Tim - W4TME

This documentation is a draft version.  It contains out of date and incorrect information and was not supposed to be available for download.  We are finalizing the PGXL documentation and as soon as it is completed and passes tech review, we'll post it on the website.

Ray - K6LJ

Thanks Tim Nice to know