Experiences and Ideas - Building a small form PC for dedicated Flex use as part of a new shack desig

Peter K1PGV

>I agree with the importance of system images. 

Hmmm... I don't see it that way myself.  I stopped creating system image backups of anything more than 10 years ago.

What I care about is my data. On my radio PC, I care about my log and I care about notes I've taken and settings I've made in various programs.

It takes about 20 minutes to install Windows to a brand new disk drive.  After that, add 15 minutes to install SSDR and whatever other software I need.  As long as I have my data, I can be very easily back in business with a clean, fresh, up to date system... and without any of the mess inherent in restoring a system image.

That's the way I see it, at least.

Peter
K1PGV

Jim Gilliam

Well...we all march to a different drummer. I restore approximately 200 GB, including data, programs and operating system in about 15 minutes restoring from one SATA drive to another. I guess I should strive for 10?

Jim, K6QE

Simon Lewis

Jim Gilliam

Last time I did "your" way, I spent half a day doing Windows updates.

Peter K1PGV

Walt - KZ1F

Wintel? If ones system slows down progressively over a couple of years, in this consumer throw-away society, people just buy a faster PC. Intel gets a new sale as does Microsoft and Dell.

Oxford English

Thanks Simon for a very interesting and informative post.

When I lived in England I ran a computer business and supplied lots of Shuttle computers, for both home use and business. My experience is similar to others on this thread, Shuttles are great computers but they do seem to have a limited life span. It really is a shame, I used to meet the Shuttle guys every year to talk about the current and future products, they were a nice bunch of guys and cared about their product but seemed to expect that computers should be replaced very 2 or 3 years and that was their design life. 

When I moved to France 10 years ago, I carried on supplying computers but tried to steer clients into buying slightly more robust machines, suffice it to say that computers I built 10 years ago are, in many cases, still working.

It just so happens that earlier this week, my own work machine, an I7 CPU & Gigabyte motherboard crashed and I decided to start looking for a replacement to put on the shelf for when the inevitable happens. Now that I am retired, I cannot justify real top of the range and to be honest, I don't really need it either (but it is nice to have!) so Simon's posting made me do some thinking and research. From what I discovered, these computers, and many others like them, are well regarded and at the price, can almost be regarded as disposable. Please note, I said almost! It grieves me to spend $400.00 in the expectation of having to spend it again in a couple of years.

Suffice it to say that I have placed an order for an I5 with an SSD and memory. Should be with me in about a week and I am looking forward to getting it fettled up and working.

Thanks Simon,

Tim  

W9OY

Tim. Pass along your experience once you get it cobbled together 73. W9OY

Oxford English

When I build a new computer, I install the OS and 'essential' software, register it with MS and then take an image of it - I use Acronis 10. I do not install any MS Updates - I have seen them make grown men cry.

Once a year or so, I reinstall the image and start again. 

For me it's just the way I have done things for the last 20 years. Bit like backing up - it's an automatic process and saves a lot of time and searching for driver disks and patches.

Tim

Jim Gilliam

In my humble opinion two things have really changed my thinking: Softether and the "embedded" computer concept supplied by Simon. It is great to belong to such a great group of hams passing on their information to make our lives with Flex more complete. Thank you all.

Jim, K6QE

Jim Gilliam

http://www.hystou.com/products/fanless-computers/c-2/page-4.html

I contacted Hystou and they said that they will supply Windows 10 free with their line of computers assuming you buy the computer supplied with a SATA SSD.

Jim, K6QE

W9OY

Excellent deal.  My computer with windows 10 works perfectly once all drivers like my scanner driver were updated.  

73  W9OY

Oxford English

Is that a 'legal'copy of Windows 10? I have asked for mine to be loaded with Win7 - just don't like the idea of MS's data acquisition policy with 10. Even though I know some of it can be turned off, I am not convinced that you can turn everything off.

After the Talk Talk hack last week (if you don't know what I am talking about, Google is your friend, just look for Talk Talk hack), I am now giving serious consideration to having a computer that is only turned on when I or my wife want to access our bank accounts of make online purchases.

Tim

Oxford English

Fully agree Jim, this forum is one of the things I love about being a Flex owner.

Lee, will do, I intend to document everything quite carefully. Going to have a lot to do when it arrives as I have an Expert 1K arriving in 3 weeks.

Tim

Jim Gilliam

I don't know it is a "legal" or cracked copy, I didn't ask. I only will be using this computer dedicated to the Flex and third party software. Don't think any hacking can take place. For corruption, I added a second (it will take 3) SSD drive for image backup in the event of corruption. Wii also do an image on an external USB HDD.

Jim, K6QE

Walt - KZ1F

Tim, in the case of talk talk, that wouldn't help. You machine wasn't hacked, theirs was.

Simon Lewis

Lee W9OY must take some credit he planted the seed .. I just pushed it on a bit

Oxford English

Agreed Walt, I do suffer from the occasional CRAFT moment from time to time!

Tim

Oxford English

First of all I want to thank Simon Lewis for his superb posting about his search for a small, quiet computer.

So, having read Simon's article and all the comments, I did some research and using the knowledge gained having had over 30 years professionally designing and building PCs, I took the plunge and ordered a computer via the Aliexpress website last Friday.

I decided on an Intel I5  1.6Ghz with 8Gb Ram and a 128Gb SSD hard disk. The price was $360.00 including DHL delivery. If I had bought a motherboard, CPU, memory, hard disk and so on, I would have easily spent the same amount of cash and had to build it.

A few minutes after placing the order. I received an email acknowledging the order and giving me a couple of days to change my mind.

3 days later another email arrived telling me that the computer had been dispatched.

This morning, it arrived, almost exactly 1 week, to the hour, after I had placed the order. 

When I ordered it, I asked for Windows 7 Pro 64 bit to be installed and it was, but Service Pack 1 was not installed

I tried to download SP1 and couldn't! I tried changing the Internet Explorer settings without success. I have been doing this sort of things for years but I could not get it to access anything without getting a security notice. 

When I had a closer look at the Windows installation, I could see that the files were all dated July 2009.Obviously it has been installed from an old image.

Rather than spend any more time getting frustrated, I decided to do a fresh install of Windows.

Over the years I have learnt that the fastest way to install Windows is from a USB drive so I plugged my Win 7 Pro 64 bit in, restarted and 9 minutes later it was done. 5 minutes later all the drivers were done - they came on a DVD and I had them ready to run on another USB drive. 30 seconds to register with Microsoft and it's ready for the next step.

Another 10 minutes and I have the wireless network up and connected, AVG and .Net installed.

3 more minutes and SSDR was installed and talking to the 6300 and I have had a QSO!

My main work machine is an I7 running at 3.4Ghz and works very well but the baby machine, running at less than half the speed with half the memory is pretty nippy. Of course it hasn't got Dreamweaver and Photoshop loaded or a lot of my other software but the decision is made - my workhorse is now only going to be switched on when I need it's brute power. This little baby is going to be my everyday/Flex machine.

The power consumption is peanuts, I haven't measured it but the PSU brick is only just warm, the computer itself is only just warm so it isn't dissipating very much. The build quality is very, very good and so far I can't find any faults with it. I may buy another 8 Gb of RAM - there is a SODIMM slot free. I will certainly add some storage - my 256Gb SSD will fit in the case.

Would I buy another one? I already have made the decision to buy 2 more and put them away for when my workhorse and media server die. For the media server I'll probably get an I3 and save a little money.

In my work life, before I retired, I personally built over 600 computers. I have installed Dells, HPs and Compaqs, from desktops to high end servers. I have been impressed by the quality of many computers but this thing ranks very high on the list of the best I have ever seen.

To say that I am pleased would be putting it mildly. To say that I am impressed would also be mild.

Is it value for money? You bet!

This little machine is superb. No question, no argument.

 

Any questions, please feel free to email me - tim (at) desarbres (dot) eu

 

Tim

Norm - W7CK

I may not know exactly what I'm talking about but here goes the question.  I seem to remember that HDMI ports have different versions.  I believe only the newest version 2.0 supports 4k at 30 or 60 fps with 4:4:4 chroma subsampling.

4K TVs can make wonderful PC displays, but not many are compatible with 4:4:4 chroma subsampling at 60Hz and 4K resolution. If a display is not using this specification, text will appear blurry.

Does anyone know if this small form factor pc with the 5200U, 5250U or 5257U processor provides HDMI v2.0 with 4:4:4 chroma subsampling?

Norm - W7CK

I think I just found some information that may be useful.  Please correct me if I"m wrong but it appears that this processor will not support HDMI v2.0 therefor may not be very good when trying to us it to display to a 4k monitor / TV.  4:4:4 chroma sub-sampling is not supported and from what I understand the display on a 4k monitor may be somewhat blurry. 

Am I understanding this technology correctly?

EA4GLI

I keep going back to this thread as a reference for a MiniPC build. Thanks OP.

Browsing through the MiniPC options at Aliexpress I found this one which has 4 RS232 ports that might be a great PC to have in the radioshack to control all those devices that still use serial ports (Amps, rotors, many current radios,etc...).

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/New-arrival-Fanless-Mini-PC-Windows-Core-i5-3317U-processor-Dual-LAN-...

Something like this with a newer processor and better video card is almost a must have.

Jim Gilliam

I have been dealing with the company directly. They hare great support and sales personnel.

http://www.hystou.com/

Norm - W7CK

Is anyone using any of these to drive a 4k monitor and if so, how is it working for you?

Oxford English

This one does, as do several others:
http://www.hystou.com/products/fanless-computers/5th-genaration-broadwell-cpu/embedded-mini-box-pc-fanless-mini-pc-with-5th-generation-intel-core-i7-5500u-8g-ram-320g-hdd-2373.html

Jim Gilliam

Also, one can order extra HDD or SSD drives as well as loaded Windows 7,8.1, or 10.

Oxford English

See my comment above about pre-loaded Windows. They don't charge for doing it but my experience says DIY is the best way to get Windows.

Tim

Steve (N9SKM)

I have an intel NUC with an i7 and its great as a shack computer.

Jim Gilliam

I think Flex has a burden on expectations. It is just a radio and a good one. But not a miracle. To meet all expectations it needs a little assistance from host computers to run all the "goody software" to be an end-all radio. I think the idea of using a small dedicated computer to provide all the peripheral support is a great help to Flex and takes a lot of pressure off of them give us everything. We are getting spoiled.

Jim, K6QE

Phil - N6ERP

Hello All - First Post..

Have taken the plunge into the world of SDR. Ordered a 6500, and really like the concept of the 12vdc Fanless PC since am running solar power with a large battery bank.

Ended up choosing this as a dedicated PC:
i7-5500u/16GB/256GB SSD/Windows 10
http://www.hystou.com/products/fanless-computers/fmp05b-core-i3-i5-i7-2-lan/16g-ram-256g-ssd-i7-4558...

When it's all up & running will share my findings..

Thanks to Simon and everyone for sharing their ideas..
-Phil