Windows 10 sneakiness alert

DrTeeth

One (of many) reason(s) I will not be using Windows 10 is that it sends usage data to MSoft and this cannot be turned off. This 'service' will also be applied to other windows versions via Windows Update - at least it can be uninstalled.

The update in question is 3068708. The OSs affected are Win 8.1, Server 2012 R2, Win 7 SP1 and Server 2008 R2 SP1. Others may be affected, like Win 8 and plain Win 7.

Chris DL5NAM

.... do you think you have any secrets that they not know ? Yes?

Believe me, also Santa bring not the presents at XMAS !

:-)

Mark_WS7M

Actually its been going on a lot earlier than you mention!   It just was not as easy to detect and I think M$ is attempting to stay out of trouble by notifying you and telling you right up front that they will be doing this.

Frankly the fact that you are posting here on Flex well the world has some usage info on you just by that.  They know your handle "Guy" and your ham calls (lots of info can be dug up that way).  I'm sure if you are actually on the air somewhere some system is tracking what bands you are heard on etc etc.

I think these days the ONLY WAY to avoid this kind of stuff is to go completely off the grid.  Use no power, radiate no signals, use absolutely no hard wire connections to anything.  Even then you can't hide from the satellites!  :-)

I think it is far easier to just be boring.  That way even though they are monitoring you, you just put them to sleep because you don't do anything interesting.

Rob G6EIH

Not doing anything to worry about, maybe we can bill MS for the data sent.

Mark_WS7M

Now that is an idea!!!   

Dave - WB5NHL

"this cannot be turned off. "    This isn't completely true. There is alot that can be done though MS doesn't necessary make it obvious. See the links below
Cortana

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2949759/windows/killing-cortana-how-to-disable-windows-10s-info-hungr...

Privacy in General

http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/bitwise/2015/08/windows_10_privacy_problems_here_s_how_bad_...

Michael Coslo

Microsoft has for a while been ignoring those requests. I don't think this is a "All your data are belong to us" situation and we've been letting Big brother know every time our backside itches for years situation, just a grant to Microsoft to have total access to our computer.

There are ways to avoid the massive telemetry. It involves using a linux hardware firewall and dlocking the dozens of phone home requests and sites. I have a listing - it's impressively long.

Until I get that set up, My W10 is on a machine with nothing else except SmartSDR, fldigi suite, WSJT and WSPR. I rather like it that way.

Walt - KZ1F

Or...people can simply abandon Microsoft products. Just imagine the bind Intuit has with their TurboTax and Qicken products. They won't just know your callsign, they will know your w-2_info. That sounds kind of conspiracy theory, doesn't it? If enough users told a vendor they didn't want software requiring Windows, the products would change.

AA0KM

Mail man can't deliver to you if you don't have an IP address. To late for what ever you use online.

You have an Ip address they know what you been up to and looking into.

Your ISP and other servers along they way have the scoop on you.

Spying Vs Privacy is a big issue .

If you been on the internet anytime they already know your behaviors, likes and dis-likes.

Kind of late to hide. Yes there are proxies and ways of hiding but a lot of work for just a simple end-user to deal with.

But the new idea's of the Os'es is to tailor your likes and dislike that's why you see all the

AD banners showing what you have all ready looked at. Hence MS and other operating systems

spies on you so they can be in the loop of making money off of advertisements that you may or may

not clicked on.

Yes there maybe ways of minimizing your presence on the www but it get's harder and harder.

To much money to be made in advertising and such.

But doesn't matter which operating system you use.

Usage tracks are often for product worthiness like how well it works or not and if it crashes or bug issues are returned to the OS programmer and how often it is used. 

If everyone understood an OS it would amaze us all what goes on under the hood.LOL.

Even me! lol

No fear here! Online since 1991. 9600Baud. wow to even think..

Be safe as you can update Anti-virus and run a few spyware removing programs.

My 2Ct's

73 Jeff

DrTeeth

Cor blimey! All I did was give my fellow hams a heads up ;-).

Ken - NM9P

Don't take it personally, mate.
There is nothing that gets folks over here involved in a discussion is the issue of privacy vs. government or large corporations!  it's in our blood!

You are likely to hear every position on the spectrum from "you got nothing to hide..so don't worry who sees it" on one hand to "You can't trust your information to those evil bureaucrats and 1 per-centers, so unroll the tin foil and build your Faraday cage!"

As many have posted...."Privacy" doesn't truly exist any more, so do what you can to minimize the risks."  (my paraphrase)

Like you, I get frustrated by all of the programmers that assume the right to use our computers to help market their stuff or generate add revenue for them unless we "opt out" or even the "let us use your machine to help us improve our program." 

If you opt out, who knows if they really abide by that?  And who is going to enforce it?

But we could all become like the eccentric guy played by Gene Hackman in the Will Smith movie, "Enemy of the State."  (A good flick, by the way.)

Ken - NM9P

WA2SQQ

So what port does this service use? Find it and block it.

Walt - KZ1F

Or, run Linux Jeff, and end your worries.

Walt - KZ1F

Or Faraday hat.

DrTeeth

I just uninstalled it.

Walt - KZ1F

This is yet one reason I think Windows is a sewer. It attracts all sorts of unsavory critters.

Rob G6EIH

Every little post on here, Facebook, Twitter, etc means thy know more about you, personally I don't care but stealing my paid for bandwidth I do object to.

Walt - KZ1F

'Stealing my paid'? I am guessing that's a typo by no clue as to of what was meant.

Ken - NM9P

I think he means using his "paid-for bandwidth" to obtain data from his computer, when he might be paying a per/Gb fee for the "privilege" of letting them spy on him using his own internet connection.

Rob G6EIH

I pay for my internet connection and I don't like it being used to by others, it should be my choice and mine alone.

That's it end of this discussion for me and time to go play radio.

Ken - NM9P

I am a fan of Linux Mint (latest version I have tried is v. 17, I think.)
If I could get SSDR, ACLog, and N1MM+ to run on it, i might consider a semi-permanent switch!  Until then, I am stuck with Win 10.  I can't afford an new apple computer right now!

Walt - KZ1F

When I last spoke to Tom (N1MM) permission to rewrite it was denied. I could maybe do a relatively close reproduction of it. It,actually, might be a good candidate for WINE.

Walt - KZ1F

Thanks for the clarification Ken, Tom.

Michael Coslo

I don't do anything online I wouldn't tell anyone about.  Yes, my ISP has a record of my web habits.

The problem as I see it is that as AA0KM notes,  you get a "tailored web experience". Microsoft doesn't want to get you in trouble, they want to get your data, and sell it to people who want to sell you things. 

Some of us don't want a tailored web experience. If I might give an example, I had to turn off adBlock and noscript once to visit TireRack.com to look at purchasing some tires. I forgot to turn them back on, and the oddest thing happened. On every site I went to after that, there was a TireRack ad for the tires I had been looking at. 

It's not tinfoil hattery to be annoyed at  that. And this isn't to diss TireRack - just a personal experience from when I forgot to re-enable some of my browser software plugins. 

Michael Coslo

They are extremely Windows Centric. I don't know if it is still there, but they used to have on their Website to not even ask for anything other than a Windows version.

Walt - KZ1F

My understanding is its written in VB. I suppose weirder things have happened, I am just not familiar with any. I totally get a hand full of people who all know VB not being terribly interested in learning a more modern language. This is why I offered to do it for them, and even give them the new source. I may not be able to nail every last flipping contest but I could nail the biggies. That I would open source, in the actual meaning of an open source project. I'd, of course, be the sole initial committer.

Bob K8RC

The paranoia exhibited here is quite entertaining. "Phoning home" was well established before Windows 2000. The main difference between then and now is they are required by law to tell you now.

Apple is the same as uSoft in this regard. And, unless you compiled your Linux from the source code yourself you are a beacon of data also.

If you are really worried about privacy, you certainly shouldn't have bought a networked SDR.
I have a nice KWM-2A that avoids these concerns. And it's EMP-proof, too.

The only spy-proof logging system is this one: http://www.arrl.org/shop/Amateur-Radio-Logbook/

Have Fun!

Walt - KZ1F

"Unless you've compiled your Linux from source code..." And the basis for that entertaining paranoia is? If it were, as you profess, in Linux it would be in source code as well. Unlike Windows which require open ports, Linux can be completely shut off from the outside world. Unless less you've enabled port forwarding to the full address and port of the radio, it too is safe from intrusion. Have you ever heard of the program Satan?

Bob K8RC

No that's not what I meant. Linux from vendors has exhibited otherwise undocumented port activity that is not to be found in the source.

If you're after total security you have to compile your operating system and all installation utilities from the source yourself. Something I haven't bothered to do since the early 80s. 

People have been trading privacy for convenience for the entire electronic age.

The humor is found in the tech-averse paranoia exhibited by a small but vocal bunch of guys out here on the cutting edge. If you're that afraid of computers perhaps you would do better with a "dumb" radio.

What proof is there that the radio's software won't spy on you if given the chance?  Flex is a vendor for the government, too, you know.

Me, I'll just have fun with my Marvelous Toy on my Windows-powered network.

Walt - KZ1F

Bob, there are some people who just don't like Windows. They use it,perhaps begrudgingly, not because its preinstalled on the computer they bought from Dell, but rather because the software they want to use for ham radio is only written in VB or C# and is only available in a win32 or .NET package. Security wise, Windows is a joke. The same is not true for Linux. I can't speak for Mac. What I find amazing and heartening are the numbers of people who will, effectively, say "you give me another option and I'll drop Linux right on top of Windows and never look back. To be sure, there are people on here with little to no computer savvy. There are others who are sysadmins, security people, software people. I do not know if what you said above is belief or said simply for effect. I can tell you its largely wrong.

Michael Coslo

To the Mac - did you know that most users do not run anti-virus software.

Nor are they infected. Sounds insane to Windows only users - where an unprotected machine is a real hazard. 


Regardless, I was a computer nerd who had virtually dumped Windows for good. Years of supporting Windows left me a deep abiding dislike.

It speak to how badly I wanted a Flex Signature radio that I started using Windows again.

And W10 works pretty well aside from that darn telemetry.

Hoping DogPark is successful.