FSK for RTTY

Ed baker

Wiring up my modem into the db15 plug I noticed that pin 4 can be used for CW?? and FSK?? If so when . Or How ?? There presently are modems out there that can provide this type of control.

Greg

The radio does not yet do FSK...at least SmartSDR does not list FSK as a mode. I've asked about this before but have not seen an answer. So I have been using the FSK pins as a CW input from my external Winkey. 73 Greg

Ed baker

Yes I too use it presently as a CW key input. However RTTY using FSK , given the way some hams set their audio drive for RTTY using AFSK Well it is just better. Lets see there is hardware in the 6500/6700 to do this. There is plenty of space in the Menu LSB, USB, CW ,AM ,DIGU, DIGL (FM) WHY Not RTTY OR FSK .

Gerald-K5SDR

We have the hardware to do FSK but the software/FPGA coding is the pacing item. I don't have a date yet.

Ed baker

Had to sleep on that answer . And I really don,t want to sound nasty .Please forgive me. It should have been functional 6 months ago.

Gerald-K5SDR

Ed, we are the only amateur radio manufacturer committed to continuous software improvement in our products. We have been doing this for over 10 years now. As an example we are releasing PowerSDR v2.7.1 for our earlier products that even adds new features to radios we no longer manufacture (FLEX-5000). I wish I could snap my finger and have every feature that everyone wanted yesterday, but the limited size of the amateur radio market means that we have a finite number of engineers. We have to prioritize those finite resources. At this moment, fully integrated DAX is considered by the vast majority of our customers to be more important than hardware FSK. We will implement hardware FSK but I just don't know which release it will be in at the time of this writing. We do release planning at the beginning of each release cycle. v1.1 release planning was done in early October right after v1.0 came out. Note that the community can vote this feature up in this thread if it is considered to be important. We do review the voting as we plan new releases.

Ed baker

I asked about FSK , not DAX or what the next release will bring to the table. You now have told me that someday it will happen . I just hope it's within my lifetime . So now !!! As a reason for the software issue I must say If your finite number of software people arn't up to or slow to the task .There are ones capable of software/FPGA coding out there . And it is not the daily internal releases that you gauge success with it is successful releases . Right now it is pretty anemic. I'll bet if you took a community vote on when the advertised functions should be there . It would be unanimous yesterday ! . . .

Ed, K0KC

Hey...as they say in Texas about driving..."post friendly". Ed, K0KC

Ed baker

Sorry Post Friendly . Friendly , Loyal, Civil, Solicitous , Sociable, Sympathetic, good, favorable, Amicable. OK it doesn't say anything about very slow providing what I bought . That comes under Eventually, Someday, Possible next year , I asked about finding FSK hardware when it was capable . I was given a answer. By the way FSK Capability was not in the original package .

Andrew O'Brien

Any time line for FSK RTTY  in a 6500?
Andy K3UK

Chris DL5NAM

>>> 2 years ago - Gerald - K5SDR, Official Rep <<<
>>We have the hardware to do FSK but the software/FPGA coding is the pacing >>item. I don't have a date yet.

AGAIN:
Any time line for FSK RTTY  in a 6500?

KY6LA_Howard

Chris flex no longer will commit or comment on planned release dates for software. BTW. You only have 4 likes on this idea so clearly it is not that important to people

Chris DL5NAM

Howard, i know and i know also b4 that no answer or comment from FRS will come. But FRS will get a reminder for an over 2 year old request for mode.
But we must be very happy: we got FM :-)

KY6LA_Howard

Keep on posting. To this topic. You may get more likes

Walt

One more vote ( as before, at least I am consistent) for FSK RTTY ( and some matching Rx RTTY specific dual/peak filters) -  It is cleanest way to do RTTY, and would complete the 'total contest radio' concept.

My hopes for the future of this radio series - I think it has the capacity to be the meanest contest machine in the hobby - which is why I bought my 6500. 

DH2ID

You also have my vote for FSK RTTY and dual bandpass filters.

Simon Lewis

yes please!

Bill N5TU

Please add FSK RTTY capability ... it is the most stable means of creating RTTY signals.  Many of us would be most grateful.  :-)

Bill, N5TU

KY6LA_Howard

We are up to 8 Likes

Please hit the Like Button At the TOP OF THE PAGE if you want FSK

Larry

10 now!

DH2ID

13, c'mon let's treble that number ;-)

Bill-W9OL

One of the major reasons I bought the 6.5K was the potential for REAL FSK operation.
Real FSK is much better in contests and when DXing.
Please consider me 'in waiting'. And add me as a 'Like'.

Jim K4JAF

Well it should be apparent that RTTY and all aspects of it such as FSK is certainly not high on Flex's list of priorities..  I still prefer to use my FT-5000 for rtty for a number of reasons..  FSK was promised in initial specifications of the 6000 series but that was soon forgotten.  As others have commented, how long must we RTTY users wait for basic operation aspects such as Mark frequency control instead of carrier frequency? 

KY6LA_Howard

Click the like box at the top of this page

k0eoo

Are we talking about adding a FSK/RTTY mode to SSDR so you can click on a spot and the radio will jump to the correct frequency & BP to  quickly work and log DX in a contest?  Like we can do now with CW and SSB?  If that's the case YES please LIKE this post up!!  I and others have been asking for this for over a year but couldn't get many interested in its importance.

Dennis, k0eoo

k3Tim

I asked before and did not receive a response so will try again...

What is the advantage of FSK over "AFSK" on the 6k series?  

In the old days of RTTY one used 88mH torroids and made a BPF for each of the M/S frequencies. If your rig didn't have FSK an audio generator was required make the two tones. Adjusting these devices (on the initial setup) was difficult at best.  Being at baseband audio for RTTY / AFSK was problematic to say the least with frequency drift and RFI being a concern.

Xmt:
Nowadays with DAX, and by way of example, FLDIGI, the "AFSK" is pure digital and is never in the analog domain. On the 6K side, I would venture to say the signal stays digital.  Noise / RFI is hence not an issue.  Stability / accuracy is from clock domains that are ultimately derived from crystal oscillators.  With MRTTY (and perhaps FLDIGI?) one can filter (waveshape) the outgoing AFSK signal and have a cleaner / narrower transmit signal.  References are on the web which I can point to if need be.  AFSK / FSK should be same assuming the FSK signal is also be wave-shaped.

Freq:
The carrier offset "features" is mitigated by setting RCV and XMT offsets to -1500 Hz (FLDIGI sweet spot is 1500 cy). One will be transmitting/receiving at the center of the M/S tones and the slice frequency readout is centered between the two.

Rcv:
On the receive side one can set the BW using one of the preset widths and have close to an optimal filter width (probably within 50 cycles).  The twin notch filtering available on some rigs for RTTY is interesting although not clear if this would help reception.  The 6K filters are very steep so interference above and below the channel is not a concern.  The frequency between M/S is filtered by the FLDIGI matched filter. Hence having a twin notch filter on a 6K would likely not bring that much to the party.  It would be informative to study the bit error rate versus Eb/No with and without such a twin-notching filter on a 6K.

Contesting:
One important point made earlier was during a contest, a station parked on a frequency would end up following the responding calls if the AFC was turned on.  With FSK this was said to be a none issue.  To solve this one could use two slices, transmit with the frequency locked in slice A and receive on slice B, with the FLDIGI AGC being able to track the return callers frequency offset (on slice .

Summary:
Stability / accuracy etc seems to be very much under control on AFSK versus FSK.
AFSK via DAX should be viewed as baseband digital signal whereas FSK is digital @frequency.


comments?

 _..--
K3Tim

Ken - NM9P

FSK or AFSK on Transmit may not be all that big a difference for the 6000 series, but if it is implemented well, the possibility of overdriving the transmitter with AFSK is eliminated.

On Receive, however, and for general "interface" issues, I think there is a real possibility for improvement, including the following that have already been mentioned:
1) RTTY frequencies centered in the receive filter automatically,
2) CLick tune that doesn't need to be adjusted with RIT/XIT offsets,
3) Implementation of dual peak RTTY filters,
4) Accurate frequency display of mark and space tones,
5) Accurate reporting of RTTY signals to spotting networks,
6) Accurate frequency transition when clicking on spotted RTTY signals.
7) Correct TX/RX frequency indication on panadapter when using XIT/RIT.

Most of these functions have work-arounds now, by calculating RIT/XIT shifts, changing filter upper/lower frequencies, etc, but it takes a couple of minutes to make all the changes to get ready for RTTY operation.

A dedicated RTTY mode that already does this would be a welcome addition.

Ken - NM9P

k3Tim

Overdrive - a good point.  One would hope we are a better class of operators to let something like that occur in our stations.

Items 1-3 and 5-9 are handled by XIT / RIT and a profile.
Item #4 - Dual Peak = does it really help?  I am skeptical.

(congrats on your LP ! )

_..--
k3Tim