So you are in Argentina? There's no TURF file for you. **** you.

YV5WZ

Hahahahaha

Greetings my good friend Steve

George, YV5WZ / PY3ZZZ

Walt - KZ1F

Huh?????? Howard, how do we get from a localization / internationalization issue to a far right distain for the center left?

Walt - KZ1F

I actually have a legitimate question on this. What is the harm to letting uses update their on turf files? As I recall flexlib has the APIs to extract as well as load turf files.

Kevin WB4AIO

Quite the opposite, Howard. I want freedom to choose and decide and take responsibility for my acts. I don't want a government nanny (though I do want fair and strong radio "traffic cops" to prevent anarchy) -- and I also don't want a corporate nanny. I want to buy a strong aluminum baseball bat, and take full responsibility for what I do with it, without bureaucrats (or manufacturers "cooperating" with bureaucrats) telling me I need a pro baseball employment contract in hand before I can get one.

I am a broadcast engineer and have used ham gear to temporarily replace an IPA or other stage in a broadcast rig in an emergency. I have used ham gear in a lab environment for many purposes, some of which include generating power outside the ham bands. We have a potential lab grade device (at prices ordinary folks can afford) that could potentially be used for many such purposes.

As for enforcement -- a friend of mine has had a neighbor's Samsung plasma TV wiping out 80 and 75 meters for more than two years now since the FCC admitted that it was causing harmful interference. The FCC refuses to enforce their own rules (though their engineers want to) because certain high-ranking bureaucrats there are "uncomfortable" with telling someone she must shut down or replace her offending TV. Hundreds of thousands if not millions of these and similar offending, illegal devices are spreading their garbage all over the bands. So, yeah, I want real enforcement. Trying to get manufacturers to do the right thing doesn't work too well.

Bill -VA3WTB

I don't think Flex is about to change their policy on this. They make sure the radio is completely legal per the place it is operated in, as it should be.

mikeatthebeach .

Just use transverter mode but add an amp ! 

Steve W6SDM

While the libertarian in me would like to see less regulation for manufacturers and more responsibility placed on operators to follow the rules, I know that it will be a futile effort based upon past experience.  In the 1970s, the Yaesu FT101 was popular with the CB crown because of the ease at which it could be turned into an all channel, 100-watt SSB CB transceiver.  Add an amp and one could "own" channel 15.

It's not just the CBers.  Look at any DX pileup and see how many intentional and unintentional ****-ups there are.  Once those ****-ups start impacting communications to other services on adjacent bands, you can expect amateur radio to be placed directly in the cross hairs of FCC scrutiny.

When I buy a transceiver for amateur radio, I expect it to operate in the amateur bands, nowhere else.  Aside from mods for related services like MARS, there really isn't any reason not to have some restriction to prevent out-of-band operation, either intentional or otherwise.

Nevertheless, the FCC should be enforcing the rules.  If they responded to 14.313 MHz as quickly and with the fervor that they did Janet Jackson's wardrobe "malfunction" in the 2004 Superbowl half time show, there would never be another violation. 

Walt - KZ1F

You mean an Austin TX company ascribes to nanny state dogma?? And, frankly Bill, with all due respect, why are you still spokesperson for FRS?

Rich McCabe

Gaston, also wanted to mention that although Tim's message may seem short to you he is in fact a really helpful guy and he did answer the question accurately.  I doubt they have time to hash out every subject in detail and if its important to you then you should submit it as a feature request.

k3Tim

Deep breath...  There now relax, take it easy.   Deep breath.  See how much better that is.....

Any mfg that has a method or means that allows a user to set a device to access frequencies outside those that are legal is opening themselves up to the potential of a large fine. A quick read of:

https://www.fcc.gov/document/fcc-settlement-tp-link

indicates a WiFi mfg was hit wiith a $200K fine for allowing users to set their region codes and use spectrum outside the allocated band. That's a lot of coin...

KY6LA_Howard

So you agree with me that the gang that can't shoot straight is doing a lousy job of enforcing the law From a totally practical point of view what is suddenly going to change so we get strong enforcement. Nothing. So why jump on Flex for making sure their radios obey the law IIRC manufacturers is SDR capable of transmitting anywhere are required by law to provide the appropriate restrictions in order to obtain type acceptance. Your plasma TV example is a non sequeter because it is not covered under the laws governing transmitters albeit it's a great example of the gang that can't shoot straight

Gastonet

Please, if you don't have nothing positive to contribute don't use this for trolling. You don't know nothing about me and even less for what is 11 meters used here.

Kevin WB4AIO

Sure, those other transceiver manufacturers provide restrictions. But those restrictions can be undone if the user needs to do so. That's what most manufacturers do, and there have been no fines as far as I know -- nor should there be.

Why punish and restrict innocent users by the hundreds or thousands just because some people are irresponsible and selfish? The people who are determined to run high power on 27 MHz or run other inappropriate frequencies are going to do it anyway -- they ARE doing it anyway, and putting restrictions in Flex gear does not reduce that one iota. So it's all pointless. Like gun control, it only punishes the innocent.

Gastonet

Steve, I'll not share the whole conversation (I don't have nothing to hide but also I don't have to share it with you), but just FYI I even offered to contribute on doing the TURF file or the information needed to create one. I'm not asking about using my radio for send a rocket, I just want to use it as I want, and quoting Kevin is the best answer "I want freedom to choose and decide and take responsibility for my acts.". If If you can think what you want, I want to use my radio as I want. Isn't fair?

Gastonet

Thanks Rich, I don't doubt that Tim is a really helpful guy, I saw him responding on other post, but I'm still unhappy with his answer about my need, use the radio "as is" maybe is not the most accurate answer. As I said, I wanted to help doing the file or providing local info to collaborate in making the file needed as I did with at least 100 apps for amateur radio.

Gastonet

Bingo Waltz! I didn't know about the API, that could was a good answer from Tim, at least a bit more than saying: use the radio "as is". I will try to find the way instead of wasting my time here reading people wasting time telling me what to do and do not with my radio. Thank you for enlighten me.

Kevin WB4AIO

By the way, don't get me wrong: I love Flex radios. A Flex is my only rig right now.

I just think they've made the wrong decision in setting themselves up as unpaid nannies for the US government.

It's an untenable position for them, really. Because they have also put themselves in the position of being unpaid nannies for the British government -- the French government --  the Bulgarian government -- now the Argentinian government -- and innumerable others, including some that no one has thought of yet, and including every change that these dozens of governments might make at any time.

Sheesh! Just give us a check box. And freedom.

Gastonet

Agree 101% I have my Flex and Maestro and I'm not only really but REALLY happy with them but also with the company itself. My post is about the Customer Care Manager answer "as is" because (IMO) isn't the better answer.

Ria

Just so we are clear - there is no FCC rule requiring certification for amateur radio equipment below 30MHz except that it is required for external RF power amplifiers. You as the licensee are ultimately responsible to ensure that your station's transmissions are within FCC regulations. (This is on the exam!)

However, equipment that can operate in the CB bands by default or with easy modification are often deemed CB transceivers by the FCC and places that sell them such as truck stops are often shut down. For example, "10 meter amateur transceivers" that can be converted to operate in the CB band or 11 meters. So the risk of Flex allowing the end user to "open up" the transmit range is too great. From what I understand Flex also supplies solutions for Government and this could put them in jeopardy. 

Kevin WB4AIO

Gaston, I hope it all works out for you -- and for Flex. Probably Tim's wording was less than optimal -- and the last two words of the title of this thread are less than optimal too.

A check box to open up the radios is the best solution. It's perfectly legal, and other manufacturers do the same or the equivalent without problems. The chances of Flex being singled out if they did the same are practically zero.

It is also legal, by the way, to transmit on any frequency in an emergency. Hard-to-reverse firmware restrictions make that impossible. I've witnessed a sinking vessel being saved in just such a situation.

W7NGA

Yeah .. I wanted to use my Flex 6500 outside the ham bands for use on my sailboat in the channelized marine communications band. Took me five minutes ... wasn't legal, but easily done. Wait .. I mean, I know a guy that knew a guy that did it for me!

W7NGA  dan
Seaside, Oregon

Gastonet

As you said, maybe a checkbox (with a disclaimer) will be the solution and it shouldn't be illegal, reverse engineering is. Nevermind, I had to be tied up and use it "as is".

Gary L. Robinson

One thing to consider is that the main lucrative part of Flex Radio's business may be with U.S. government contracts and sales.   Think about that ...

---Gary WB8ROL

mikeatthebeach .

I have Microwave transverter's at 10GHz, 24GHz, 47GHz
Using the transverter mode get me to those frequencies with the Flex 
as an IF ( Freedom to chose my IF Frequency )

IEEE-MTT Ham Radio 10GHz Radio at IEEE-MTT Conference
50MHz and Up Microwave Group of Radio Amateurs
RF/Microwave Engineers in Ham Radio

http://www.50mhzandup.org/hrs.html

A lot of use SDR & Flex Radio's

Ria

I have no problem with the legal 11m argentine allocation. It is legal for you to use. Do understand though that the FCC takes a dim view of modified ham equipment for that band. This is probably what Flex is considering. Hopefully this will be resolved with technology to add this range for you while disabling it for USA users.

I'm not familiar with TURF files. Are they tied to a specific radio? Or can one be used on any radio? The latter can be problematic.

Ria

They can't collect from hams. They can from corporations. Look at how long it took them to collect from K1MAN, eventually deep sixed his license during the red light review and STILL haven't collected. A friend of mine is an economist at the CBO and she tells me that the FCC is basically self funded. So that's why amateur enforcement takes a low priority.

mikeatthebeach .

Tim - W4TME

Sorry, but I have to respond here because our conversation was not published in its entirety.  Below is my response that Gason has chosen not to include.

We export our radios as amateur radio equipment and because they are SDRs, as a radio manufacturer are not allowed to provide user access to the firmware to change the transmit frequencies of the radio regardless of that you are allowed to do as an operator. I am sorry that this answer is not what you expected or satisfactory, but using the radio with the current transmit frequency settings of the US is the only option available, hence my "as is" statement.

At this time I am closing this post as the "problem" has been addressed.