SSDR V3 and memory overwriting TX Band Settings

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OK, so I have a couple of Transmit profiles setup, 1 for driving and amp and one bypassing the amp. In there I have drive power for the amp (around 20W). If settings get changed then a simple revert to the given profile brings everything back.

 I upgraded to V3 and now if I recall a freq memory, whatever power level I had in the memory overwrites the power setting in TX Band Settings. There is no alert that is is changing my profiles. Not a good thing at all. How can I prevent this from happening? This needs to be fixed.

Gary NC3Z
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Gary NC3Z

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Posted 5 months ago

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K3DCW

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Gary,

This is covered in the release notes and is a "feature:"

     TX/MIC Profile Changes – all settings are now saved on-the-fly (as settings are changed).



I'm with you in preferring the old way of doing it. The whole idea of Profiles is to allow a quick recall of a set of operating parameters from which you can adjust, as necessary, but which you can always return to with a click of the mouse.  Now, once you make a change, your profiles are done for.

I'm sure there was a reason for this, but I sure can't figure out what it was.

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Gary NC3Z

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Dang, this is not a good thing. So why have the feature of a band by band drive level setting but then have this over-written? This was a bad move Flex, at least let us choose to have it do this.
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Bill -VA3WTB

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I thought the same way but after a bit I understand how it works,,, I love it
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K3DCW

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So, how do you use this during normal operation to return to a known set of parameters -- a baseline if you will -- once you've made a change to one of those profiles during operation?

I'm all for innovation and am quite willing to adjust my operations if it is beneficial and I understand it, but I'm just curious how you're making this work for you.
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Bill -VA3WTB

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It does not change the way I use the profiles. When we save the profiles a file is created that we can always bring back anytime. What I like is being able to change the little things without having to sift through menues to find them, thay are all there in on place. 

If I mess things up to far, I just bring back my saved profiles again, all fixed.
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Cal Spreitzer

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I was wondering the same thing!  This makes no sense to me.  If I call up a particular mic profile and make any change to that original profile it is now updated on the fly and the original is lost.  I can no longer load it....  Unless I restore a previous backup.  I don't care for it! 

Cal/N3CAL
(Edited)
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Gary NC3Z

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Bill - How are you doing this? 
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Bill -VA3WTB

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When we save a profile, it creats a file,,this file is never changed. The profiles in the radio change with this save on the fly,,but the profiles file stayes the same. When you want to bring back your original profile select that saved file.

You can keep that profiles file on a thumb drive if you want to.
(Edited)
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K3DCW

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So, basically the same as before, but with the added step of having to load from a file rather than simply going to the menu and selecting a profile.  Not a major change, but still why that has me scratching my head a bit to understand why it was done.
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Bill -VA3WTB

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I think it was contesting driven, Seting the radio up for a contest is easy now having it all in one panel. And now little changes can be applied and saved on the fly not taking the attention away from the operations. Now unless you make big sweeping changes you could simply bring up the panel and change a setting back.

It is also important for a station to set RF power per band on the panel as an example.
All your profiles stay much the same as always, depending how many things you keep changing on the on the fly panel, If you don't change things much then your profiles will come up as you left them.
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Gary NC3Z

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Bill, your talking about the Import/Export to bring back a profile?
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Bill -VA3WTB

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In my early comments I was refuring to the Import/export,,,yes,,,it just fetches a saved file to Import.
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W2NER

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I agree, this was not a good move.  I have had a flex in one form or another and this is by far a feature that should have the ability to enable or not.  I have been having problems with my TX profiles I create disappearing which I contribute to this NEW feature.  If this was done for the contest community, thats a SMALL part of the consumers for a flex radio.  Again, this should be a enable or not feature.  Also who's bright I idea was it to have a TX profile be overwritten automatically?   Stupid move IMO... 
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Tom N5MOA

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This is covered in the release notes and is a "feature:"

     TX/MIC Profile Changes – all settings are now saved on-the-fly (as settings are changed).


One of the reasons I have no desire to "upgrade" to v3.
Not being able to turn that "feature" off is silly, imo.
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Pat N6PAT

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This would not work for me at all. I use 2 different amps. One uses 50 watts input while the other uses only 3 watts - 50 watts would fry it. I control the input via profiles.

While I'm not going to upgrade to V3 I still must be concerned with this "feature" as it most likely will be carried forward to future versions of SSDR.

Having to import the profiles after a slight change to get the settings back is ridiculous to say the least. 

What's the point of having saved profiles if they get changed all the time?
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Gary, I hope I answered some of your questions. This feature may not be for every operater. I don't have it because I am still in V2 were I think I will stay. But from the information I have read, and going by comments from Ken it seems to be a nice addition.
It looks like the best part of it is how you can set each band up for what ever RF power you want for more than one amp.

Anyways it is interesting times...good luck.
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K3DCW

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Bill,

Up near the top of this thread you said that you "love it" in reference to this change in the way profiles are handled, but now you say that you don't have v3 and don't plan on going to it.

So, you don't even have to deal with this "feature" which begs the question: how can you love something that you don't use. . . that you don't even have?

Color me confused.
(Edited)
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Lol, sorry, I know what you mean...
I have talked to Ken and he has done a lot of research on this subject, I like what he explains about how it works, but he said it takes getting used to.
Also I have talked to a few alfa testers as well and they talked about things they had concerns about, but afer using it a while they have come to understand it better.

So from what I learned, I love what it does. Sorry about the confusion.

I guess it's the same as some saying it sucks but have never used it either.
(Edited)
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W2NER

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Unbelievable, how in gods name can you have an opinion on something you never used and just go by someone else's thoughts?? Are you kidding me???  As I said earlier in this post, the largest part of the flex community is NOT contesters and therefore would not make use of such a crazy feature you can't turn off!!  Don't make judgments on something you never used. OMG!!
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Pat N6PAT

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You can have an opinion on this even if you are not going to upgrade to V3 because this "feature" will no doubt be carried forward. Sooner or later when you upgrade to a future version V4, V5, etc. you will have to deal with it.
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W2NER

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Wrong, you can't have an opinion on something you never used, thats just nuts and if you think thats okay, your just as clueless.   How can you say something is good or not if you never had it or used it??  Listen to what you are saying. He said he loved it!!  How can you love a feature you never used????????
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Bill -VA3WTB

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The sourses I talked to are very trust worthy, they are worth listening to.
They explained how it works, I think It's a great Idea based on What they said.

And as pat said we can have an opinion even while vever using it.
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W2NER

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This is like talking to the wall.  I use to evaluate software and hardware for big blue and if I did my job like what you are saying, I would have been shown the door.  Do you drink the kool aid too?
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I never used a brick as a flotation device by I have an opinion that it won't work.
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W2NER

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That comment is idiotic. 
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Thats ok, I respect your opinions, both of you....
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Gary NC3Z

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Bill - Yes you answered my questions. I understand what they did BUT I do not like it, I really liked the concept of the drive by band, but this overwrite kills that feature.

Flex, are you monitoring? Please, please give us a way to turn this off. Twice now I have seen my drive level too high because the auto save over wrote.
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Gary, one of the purpose of this feature is to protect from over driving an amp. It will follow the drive level you set in the Tx panel for that band. It will change that setting in your profile as it should.

Your profiles are still what is running your radio as far as settings go. That is the reason for over write, you change settings if you want to in the settings panel on the fly, but your operating with the profile you sellect.

It is a different way then your used to, but soon I think you will understand how it works together.
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Gary NC3Z

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Well the way this is now implemented it has the opposite effect. Sorry but this "new" V3 feature is not good. It is a danger to over driving an amp as the presets are over ridden by several things including recalling a memory.

I clearly understand how it works and I do not like it. I understand to bring back a profile I now need to do an import, a  big step backwards in my opinion.

You may like the way V3 is doing this, I do not.

I have profiles setup for driving and amp, one for no amp but 100W, one for Digital. And they get all over written when they should not. I can not accept the way it works now, and it defies the manual with this "feature".
(Edited)
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Pat N6PAT

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I wonder who's coming up with these feature ideas? Was it a software engineer? Did any customers request this feature? If so how many?

Flex needs to get more in touch with the wants/needs.that appeal to the majority of the customers and not just a certain few.  Just look at how many people either don't like the new version or are just buying it to support Flex. Does that spell satisfaction?
(Edited)
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W2NER

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Bill your statement "one of the purpose of this feature is to protect from overdriving an amp" . That's one thing it's NOT doing, matter of fact it's just the opposite, it causes overdrive.   Anyway, I think we beat this thing to death and what comes out of this is, Flex must make this a enabled option, not force it on a OP as the default with no way to disable it.   I have back leveled my 6600 back to 2.4.9 as this feature I can't stand.  
(Edited)
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Can you help me understand if you have the drive levels set per band how it is over driving?
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W2NER

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If you read all the comments made above you will see what we are talking about.  Both Gary "NC3Z" and myself made it very clear.  These settings are not fixed in the DB, they are changed on the fly by whatever the status is in the software willy nilly. 
(Edited)
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Gary NC3Z

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If you set the Drive by Band to say 25 and then you recall another profile (say one for no amp but 100W out, or a memory) then that drive level is now inserted into the Drive by Band matrix. So now in place of 25 you now have 100. Some amps only will take 20, 30, 40W max.

In V2 it was very easy to just recall a profile, and if the profile was changed SSDR indicated this with a *

Bill, you can easily see this happening, give it a try and see what it does on your end.
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Ok, see I don't have V3, I did not know the Tx  on the fly panel over rides all profiles. I thought each profile had it's own panel.
I am going to pick Kens brains about this and see his take on it.
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W2NER

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Just update and see for yourself and stop relying on hearsay. 
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Gary NC3Z

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Bill, yes it over rides all, that why I do not like it. V2 profiles were superior.
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Ok Gary thanks,, maybe Ken can chime in here if he stops bye, He digs deep into this stuff and I trust his comments. I would think if other testers are having problems flex will re visit this.
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Mark K1LSB

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"One of the reasons I have no desire to "upgrade" to v3.  Not being able to turn that "feature" off is silly, imo." -- Tom N5MOA

Agreed, they've effectively taken away the Profile save feature, such that if you make any session change there's no easy way to get back to your previously defined and saved profile. I wonder who decided that was a good idea to spring on everyone with no previous warning.

Which begs the question, will this new "feature" be in the next v2 release (assuming there will be any next release)? I sure hope not, I was looking forward to a number of fixes of several current long-standing bugs, and I don't want to have to pay the price of giving up a long-existing feature just to obtain some hoped-for fixes.
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Mark no features added to V3 will be back ported to V2.5
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W2NER

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I went back to ver 2.4.9 till they smarten up and fix this.
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K3DCW

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I still don't get the logic that this was intended for the contesting community. As a casual contester, and as a member of a big contesting club, I don't know any hard-core contesters that would want to make what is effectively a permanent alteration to their operating station mid-stream in a contest, but this is exactly what this does. Once you change something, it is now a permanent part of the profile unless you take an even longer time to locate an archived profile file and reload it to undo the change. Previously, it could be done with just one or two mouse clicks. This logic makes no sense to me.

Nothing new in v3 that I needed even though I do like the MultiFlex. However, this one change really messes with my operating process and defeats the whole purpose of profiles to begin with, so back to v2.4.9 for me as well.

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Mark K1LSB

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"Mark no features added to V3 will be back ported to V2.5" -- Bill VA3WTB

Bill, 2 questions:

1)  Do you work for Flex? I ask because you have a history of speaking as though you're privy to factory information that the rest of us don't have access to.

2)  If you don't work for Flex, then why do you post statements that only Flex representatives should rightly be making? As just one example, 10 months ago Michael Coslo posted a question in a thread relating to the cooling fans, asking specifically what the fans are lubed with at the factory, and you replied, "3&1 oil is fine".  That's misleading, because you're not a factory representative - I know you're not, because I've seen a post by a Flex representative stating specifically that you don't work for Flex or represent Flex.

So do us all a favor and stop pretending like you speak for Flex, because you don't.
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Pat N6PAT

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I've said those same words before.. Only Flex employees should be speaking for Flex
(Edited)
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Mark,,,That was a statment from Flex. But they can change their mind.  And NOPE

I did go back and found my reply as to the kind of oil used at the factory. I did not say the fans are lubricated with 3&1 oil at the factory. This was a cary over conversation in an earlier thread were I suggested servicing the fans first with a drop of oil. He asked what the fans are oiled with at the factory, and I said 3&1 oil is fine.

That should clear up your misleading comment, Thanks for pointing that out.
(Edited)
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Gary NC3Z

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I opened up a HD ticket on this and after some back and forth this is what I got back from Flex:

"The analysis of your Helpdesk support incident has concluded that the issue you reported is a possible software defect. I have transferred this issue to the Engineering/Software Development group and placed it in their bug tracker for further analysis.

This issue has been logged as defect number: GH 7368"

This is focused on the issue of a memory recall over writing the Power by Band settings.

As for the profiles being permanently over written on any change, well we will see if Flex considers fixing this. I, like many responses, are hoping for this.
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W2NER

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I posted this in another string so I'll put it here as well in the hopes flex is watching.  

There's another feature or change they made.  In TX or MIC profiles is a button that says "reset" what the hell is that for?  I tested it and it creates a additional profile named "Default" so then you have 2 profiles named default.  Additionally you can't remove any of them.  OMG flex, are your software engineers drinking on the job?

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W2NER

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Here's the email I got back after opening a ticket about the profile issue.  Apparently they are watching cause I did not say anything about switching versions.  Which has nothing to do with it.  This issue was prior to any switching of versions. 

Sorry to hear that it seems like your TX Profiles are disappearing.  Can you tell me more about what you are doing between when they are present and when they are gone?


We are aware of an issue where if you jump back and forth between v2.4 and v3.0, you may experience data loss with profiles as a result of the database schema changes.  For this reason, we recommend exporting your settings including your profiles prior to jumping between v3.0 and any versions before it.  We would also recommend that if you are going back to v2.4 from v3.0 that you do a factory reset followed by importing your settings that you hopefully exported prior to upgrading from v2.4.  This will allow you to go back and forth without losing data.




(Edited)