I loaded 1.5 and everything works except the wide noise blanker. I see no diferance on or off. Am I missing somthing

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  • Updated 3 years ago
Loaded 1.5 and the wide noise blanker does not seem to work. I see the icon WNB flashing off and on but do not hear any deference in the audio or scope.  
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Dennis Daniel KM6DF

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Posted 3 years ago

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Walt - KZ1F

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There are several threads on this subject. It is my hope that perhaps Steve can peruse through them all and find either a common thing we are all doing wrong or something. As I said in an earlier thread,we have the exact same software Lee, who made two videos, has so if it works for him it should work for everybody. A couple of observations. I enumerate these to see if others see the same. 1) the control seems to only do anything at the 100 (far right) position. 2) not in Lee's videos, the noise floor jumps quite erradically as the lettering switches from dim to brighter.

Do we have those symptoms in common?
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WX7Y

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I think this mostly depends on what kind of noise you have at your location to deal with to see just how well the WNB works.
My location is pretty quiet compared to what others have to deal with most of the time which made the old NB work better on atmospheric noise for me but also distorted the high strength signals audio much worse so I hardly ever used it.

Unfortunately there are so many different kinds of interfering noise on the HF bands that there will probably never be a perfect noise blanker for any and all type of noise with out having a plethora of user settings that most users would have much difficulty setting up correctly for the ever changing atmospheric and man-made noise on the bands.

I thank the FLEX engineers for building a great SmartSDR update to the Flex signature series and I know that there working hard on trying to find the bugs we have found and reported and get them taken care of.

73's
Bret
WX7Y
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Dennis Daniel KM6DF

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I understand the deference in types of noise but I see no change at all compared to the video that was demonstrated. I am running a flex 6500 and the OS is W10
73's
Dennis
KM6DF
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Walt - KZ1F

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The OS is not relevant to WNB. Do you see the same erradic movement in the noise floor as I mentioned? In Lee's video I didn't see any movement in his noise floor.

Also, apparently, I dont appreciate the difference is noise source as it relates to noise blanking. I had asked for an explanation of correlated noise (vs, I guess, uncorrelated noise). Esp on the lower bands I get nightly noise that displays as half moons out of the noise floor. I thought that was electrical in nature. 
(Edited)
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Marv

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First off what kind of noise are you trying to eliminate.  WSB is very effective for me , as I have a lot of Electrical Line noise and it has been wiping it very effectively.  Also I am not hearing it generate distortion on incoming signals as a lot of NB's do

Marv W0ZK

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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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Official Response
@Walt

There is a lot of confusion as to when to use WNB and Whento use NR.

A lot of the complaints that WNB does nothing is likely due to a total misunderstanding of what each of WNB and NR does.

Correlated Noise is noise that follows a repetitive pattern such as ignition noise, electrical fences, fluorescent ballasts. WNB listens to a broad area of spectrum to see if it can identify a pattern. If it does find a pattern, then simplistically it inverts the pattern and injects that pattern 180 degrees out of phase with the original corolated noise source to cancel the noise If you look at some of the videos you will see that WNB is removing an astounding 25-30dB of correlated Noise. This is clearly a Best in Class achievement as I am unaware of any other Ham grade products that come close to this.

Uncorrolated noise is random noise that does not follow a particular pattern. If you have uncorrolated noise then you should be using NR to minimize the noise. Most of us have uncorrolated noise and should be using a combination of AGC-T and NR to mitigate noise.

ANF - automatic notch filter is a specific filter to notch out a single noise source.

TNF. Another Flex exclusive is multiple tunable notch filters that can be placed on interfering signals ...almost impossible to do with legacy technology.
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Walt - KZ1F

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What I see is very predictable and very constant. What I see, when I perceive it is working, albeit intermittently, always requires the slider be at100%. But then I'd miss one out of every three syllables and whole words in cw.
However, put the way you just put it Howard, I totally get it. And what I see does qualify as correlated noise. I thought Tim said you don't want the slider at 100, that it should be around 50.
(Edited)
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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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The level really depends on the intensity and correlation of the pattern. By 100 you are getting very aggressive with the algorithm to try to force it to find a pattern so it is more likely to screw up and cut off characters. Unfortunately there is no current optimum setting albeit it may be possible to create a hunting algorithm to automatically find a sweet spot.

The other thing is that the algorithm already readjusts itself to try to I dentiify patterns.
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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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I might add that a lot of people think they have correlate nose that the WNB should remove but in fact there is little actual,correlation in the noise patterns.
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Gerald - K5SDR, Employee

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I can confirm that Howard is 100% correct in his explanation.  I have learned that very few hams, including technical types, understand noise.  You have to use the right tool for the job.  
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Jon - KF2E

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I normally have S4-S5 noise at my QTH. Sometimes it jumps to S9. My old 5000 would drop the noise to useable levels. It was like magic. On my 6500 both the NR and new WNB don't seem to have a positive effect, no matter how I adjust them. Perhaps you can suggest what the correct tool might be since I obviously don't understand.

Jon...kf2e
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Mike KD2CJJ

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Post a video
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Jerry Wilk

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AA7SN

As I mentioned my Yaesu FT-2000D NB will lower the overall noise I am hearing but the 6300 WNB has no effect unless it is set at 100% and then it just starts the noise floor to jump up but no noise lowering.  My Flex 5000 seems to have great effect on the noise floor using its NB.

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Tim - W4TME, Customer Experience Manager

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This indicates that your noise source is uncorrelated and the WNB is not effective on this type of noise signature.  The NB in the FLEX-5000 is not wide band.
(Edited)
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pa0bie

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On 160 , 80 and 40 meters i am using a 4 meter wide Magnetic Loop antenne.  I have a lot of correlated noise but that is not recognized by the WNB. The peak in the niddle is my ML antenne.



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Cal Spreitzer - N3CAL

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What does the flashing WNB mean in the upper right corner of the screen?  The latest user guide does not mention it?  Is it always flashing or can it be solid?   Also I've noticed that with the DIGIU mode selected there is no NB or TNF shown??  There is WNB and a slider below it but I haven't found anything in the manual on it? 

Cal/N3CAL 
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Ross - K9COX

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Page 40 of the new software users guide
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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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Flashing WNB means it's search for a correlated noise solution and has not found one yet.
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Tim - W4TME, Customer Experience Manager

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Jan - your noise signature is not correlated enough.  Narrow down the panadapter until the preselectors are enabled (WIDE is not shown).  Then increase the WNB threshold (aggressiveness) until you see the noise floor drop.  If that doesn't happen, then the noise is not periodic enough for WNB to train on it.
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Jon - KF2E

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Does the wnb only process the spectrum displayed in the panadapter?
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Mike KD2CJJ

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What I have noticed is the WNB goes on and off also... unfortunately it goes on and off every 20 seconds.  when its on my noise floor drops nicely... but when it goes off the noise goes up.  Thats pretty annoying as clearly its working but not holding.  I believe when I get a snap it turns off (like a electrical snap type noise).  Tim, I have a 6300 without a preselector.  Is there another technique?
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Walt - KZ1F

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Yes, same thing here.I believe I described this. Thanks for elaborating on it.
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Ross - K9COX

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Have three buttons, NB, WNB, and NR. SMOP
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Mike KD2CJJ

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You have NB and WNB - you may have some Experimental build.
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pa0bie

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Tim , normally I look at a smaller span of the panadaptor.  When I enable the WNB nothig is happening until I increase the WNB threshold. Above 90 % then I see the noise floor going UP !!!!  I have the wrong type os noise.  Thanks for Your explanation and help.
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Tim - W4TME, Customer Experience Manager

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"Have three buttons, NB, WNB, and NR."

You may get your wish.  We are looking into it.
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Bill Roberts

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Just tested WNB on nasty prolonged buzz I hear during the day. With AGC-T at 23, offending noose started going away at about 65 and was totally gone at 80. Turning WNB off and on again took out noise in about .5 sec. No distortion noticed on strong signals. You can see the noise go away in the panadaptor. Cool!
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Paul - W3PH

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I've been a skeptic because until tonight WNB seemed to do no good at all at my relatively quiet location.  Tonight on 80 CW I found some really bad power line noise that pretty much covered everything else up.  Clicked WNB and presto:  panadapter cleared up and I could see & hear signals.  Now I'm a believer - when it works, WNB really works.    W3PH