Better RX than average?

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  • Question
  • Updated 3 years ago
6000-Series users...

Do you notice a significant difference between the signal reports you send and those you receive? I'm curious since I usually get weaker reports than I give -- could it be the Flex 6000 receiver, DAX, and WSJT-x 1.5 giving that much advantage on receive? Or am I just not getting out as well as I should be? It's often about 10 db, especially on 20m.

I notice the same on all modes, but it's most "obvious" on JT65/JT9 with "true" reports being generated and with everyone (supposedly) running similar power levels.

Every so often, I get a nicely matching Sent and Received report and wonder if I've just worked a fellow Flexer.

Not saying I don't get out, I'm just wondering if anyone else sees a difference. Would rather have a better receiver any day than be an "alligator."

Cheers!
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George Molnar, KF2T, Elmer

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  • curious while waiting for the bands to open...

Posted 3 years ago

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Ken - NM9P, Elmer

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With my 6500 and dipole/vertical setup I usually have the opposite experience on SSB. I often get S9+10 or 20 from stations that are only S9 on my receiver. I chalk it up to Flex having a "real" S-meter that doesn't get boosted by the preamp as many other rigs do.
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Walt - KZ1F

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George, what is a true report and when did ham operators start using them? Getting out more is always better.
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Jay / NO5J

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George

Our truer reports are just truer. We can accurately, hear better and be heard with less power. Reality vs Fantasy!

73, Jay - NO5J
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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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@Walt

JT-65 gives true reports because it is what the decoding software decides that it is hearing..

NO Ham Opinions.

I have worked a DL at -29dB on JT-65 but  I had an ERP of about 250W so he heard me at -19dB

From our less than totally scientific testing albeit with reproducible results on the same antennas and same time we were getting reliable decodes on the 6700 at -27dB but with a IC-7700 only -19dB ...

I chalk up the difference in receive to much lower phase noise in the 6700 and the total lack of Analog to Digital to Analog Cabling and external decoders needed with the IC-7700 which likely adds 3-6 dB

It will be interesting to run a new K3-S with its new internal DAX like system (Yes Elecraft is trying to catch up to Flex on Digital) vs the 6700.
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Bob Wright, N7ZO

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Hi Howard,

I have noted similar improvements with my 6700 vs my K3 (with original synthesizer).  (The 6700 is using DAX, of course, and the K3 is using a MicroHam Microkeyer II.).   I routinely get JT-65 decodes in the -27dB area now, sometimes even -30dB  The best I had ever seen with the K3 was around -25dB.  I am estimating a 3-5dB improvement with the 6700.  Very impressive.

The Microkeyer II has a decent ADC, but those currently using SignaLink or similar quality ADC's may see improvements with the K3's USB audio connections.  It will also be interesting to see whether the new synthesizer will improve things.

I should add that I am having a hard time justifying putting any more money into my K3 (for the synthesizer upgrade).  The K3 sits mostly idle since I bought the 6700.

73, Bob, N7ZO
(Edited)
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km9r.mike

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My dx reports are normally @ -20db or less because I am usually txmitting @ 1w or less. However, on psk reporter I will see from -8db to -20db receptions @ the same power level up and down the east coast. Not all receive stations are created equally as has already been stated.

The best decode I have seen by my 6300 has been @ -27db. I have not decoded a signal less than -27db nor have I seen such reports sent by other stations on the band. Not saying that it can not happen. I just have not seen it yet nor has my 6300 done it yet but always trying to increase the ability to decode the weakest of signals.
(Edited)
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Cal Spreitzer

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George my experience with signal reports on WSJT-x is opposite of yours.  Most of the time when working JT-9 or JT-65 my reception reports I give out are less than the station that reports my signal.  I can attribute that to the fact I'm using a Pixel RF Broadband Magnetic Loop as my receive antenna and a 43' Vertical for transmit.  The loop is usually around 2 S units lower than my other antennas but it really pulls the weak signals out of the noise.  Like Mike,  my 6300 will have -27db decodes. (JT-9) . 

Cal / N3CAL
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N7AIG

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 ummm... if the pixel loop has better SNR, even though the absolute signal level is 2 S units lower, it ought to be giving higher report numbers, not lower, on receive.
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N7AIG

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oh, perhaps I'm interpreting your statement backwards? lower numbers might mean better, as in I'm hearing you at lower SNR levels. In that case, it makes sense, and it is a good thing.

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Ross - K9COX

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I hear voices on my Flex even when it's turned off.
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km9r.mike

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Get more rest.