Any ETA on when Maestro ships

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I'm sorry if this has already been posted but I haven't been active in the community in awhile.  I had thought Maestro was supposed to ship by the 4th qtr?  I'm not in a hurry but was curious if there was a new time frame.

Burch
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Burch - K4QXX

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Posted 3 years ago

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W2NER

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Again and I don't know how many times I need to say it. If the company doesn't have a product that they can deliver there's no point of excepting orders. If you don't have the budget then you need to go to resources that you can depend on to get the money you need to develop that product not depend on customers to finance your projects
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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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Again.. and Again.. Clearly you are in the Fortune 500 world.. for the rest of us, customer deposits are essential BEFORE you start to develop a product in order to gauge interest in the product and to garner firm commitments to buy the product...

Again.. you are thinking Fortune 500 when you say "you need to go to resources that you can depend on to get the money you need to develop that product " for the rest of the commercial world those sources of finance just do not exist...

Hence the success of things like Kickstarter.. where customers put up 100% of the money up front to finance development...
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W2NER

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Clearly you're a diehard flex supporter with no vision on what it takes to run a company or run a project. I don't know how many times I need to say it you should not rely on a customer base I don't care how big or how small your company is to finance your projects. Nonetheless to make commitments that you forever miss
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Yet another one telling Flex they don't know how to run their company, too funny.....
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W2NER

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Another dense consumer who just doesn't get it that the customer should not finance companies project, more funny
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Steve K9ZW, Elmer

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A consumer can enter into whatever arrangements they want to, including funding projects. 

It is common across many industries to accept pre-orders, and not always just for early adopters but for all buyers.

Respectfully YMMV as doing pre-orders and pre-payments for soon to be released products is not everyone's cup of tea. 

It is unfortunate that the PayPal centered issue of PayPal being unable to process a deposit and later process a product delivery has upset folk, but this is much more an issue with their third-party payer's rules - with PayPal's rules - than to do with FRS. 

FRS has other payment options that reduced the upfront payment to earnest money rather than payment in full. 

Not using those methods and specifically using PayPal is a consumer's choice that comes part and parcel with accepting the PayPal rules with their quirks and foibles.  Understanding PayPal's business model we need to remember we are only the consumer side revenue source for them with the vendor being hit up for another set of expensive fees, and PayPal stacks the rules in their financial & risk holding favor. 

All this said, looking at a production Maestro at Hamcation two weekends back, even my XYL left the Maestro demonstration impressed & excited for what the unit does,  and our wait will someday be just a memory we can talk about on the air.

73

Steve K9ZW


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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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I guess that having founded and run over a dozen companies in my life (including 2 that I took public) does not qualify me as having the vision to run a company.. nor does the hundreds of successful projects that my companies have build qualify me to run a project

But not having that "Vision" but having had that real world experience, invariably the funds you need to start those companies or build those project usually comes from customer deposits.. not from some mysterious magical sources of funds that only Fortune 500 companies have access to....
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W2NER

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There are many companues that does not use customers to finance their projects or taking deposits on something they don't have to deliver. Apache labs doesn't do it, ELAD doesn't do it, I've never seen the Yaesu or Kenwood do it. The list can go on an. And if you think customers should finance projects of companies then no you do not know how to run a business
(Edited)
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EA4GLI - 8P9EH - Salvador

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I followed the link to see what the process was to PRE-ORDER a cellphone from SAMSUNG through BEST BUY.

This is where it took me.



No information whatsoever of when the device will be delivered and paying the whole thing upfront.

This is Samsung and Best Buy, by no means small shops.
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EA4GLI - 8P9EH - Salvador

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Apache Labs



Guess how much I have to pay if I want to check it out of the cart....

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W2NER

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I'm not going to get into this crap again. Read my post. When I placed the order back in January NOTHING was stated about it being a pre order. And nothing stared anything about it being delayed for a month like it states now.
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EA4GLI - 8P9EH - Salvador

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You seem to have a double standard Nick. In the post above you stated that Apache Labs doesn't do it. I prove you wrong and you answer with: "I'm not going to get into this crap again." which I find is an uncalled-for response. 

And about not knowing it was pre-order.... come on seriously? You joined the community on July 14, 2014. How can you say that you didn't know the Maestro was Pre-Order?? 

Giving your propensity to misrepresent information to your advantage (proved by your misrepresentation of what other companies do with pre-orders) I "cry foul" in not knowing it was a pre-order.
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Walt - KZ1F

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I have a thought. How about we all accept it'll ship when it ships. Continually asking for an ETA is akin to asking mommy 'are we there yet'. Arguing with someone who is unhappy just pisses people off, "never try to tech a pig to sing, it just wastes your time and annoys the pig'.

Perhaps it's time FRS considers closing this conversation.

And yes, I realize I don't have a squeaky clean record on this either. Consider though, if even I say enough, it's probably come off the rails already. Just saying.
(Edited)
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Norm - W7CK

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Nick.  Their are many ways to run a business.  I think it is great that Flex lets all of us know what is coming down the pike.  They often let us know when the product is still in the planning stages.  How often do other companies do that?  It takes a lot of effort to get a product off the ground, and finally into production.  I for one really appreciate that Flex shares their visions and projected targets with us.  I have spent most of my life providing software services to government agencies and can tell you, very seldom are projected product production timelines met.  Flex is a small company, they produce an amazing product and I for one don't mind waiting until they feel their hardware and or software offerings are ready for market.  I love the fact that we as a community have been told of the Maestro well before its release.  I've been able to ponder how I plan on using the product and now have dreams of its arrival. Any other manufacture would not have told us anything until it was ready to ship.  Shoot, just knowing the Maestro was on its way has helped me plan how my station will operate in the future and how I might better be prepared.  The pre-knowledge of its eventual release has helped me understand the vision of Flex Radio and where we might all be heading.  I love the fact that Flex shares this information and their vision with us.  I think its been and will continue to be an exciting ride, don't you?

I don't mind waiting. 

P.S.  I did get a chance to play with the Maestro while at the Yuma Hamfest and all I can say is it is a work of art.  Its quite solid, beautifully designed, controls operate smoothly, and actually surpassed my expectations.  It took all I had to keep from drooling all over the display table......
(Edited)
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W2NER

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I agree with everything you just said 100% I just don't think it's fair that I have to pay whether it be through PayPal credit card it doesn't matter 100% of the product cost and I'm waiting for months. It doesn't make any sense to me why should I have to pay $1200 for something im not going to see because it's not ready to be delivered. If they only were going to take a deposit of $100 then I fully understand. them charging me full price for something they can't deliver, no sorry I don't think that's right
(Edited)
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K1UO - Larry

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You DID cancel in order to show your indignation ... right??
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Norm - W7CK

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Nick.  Although its been a few months ago, I only paid $100 for my pre-order.  This was to guarantee I get the Maestro at a little bit of a reduced price when it is released.  I knew when I pre-ordered it would be a while before I take delivery and I was good with that. 

If you feel your financing Flex products, why don't you just wait until the product your interested in is actually shipping before you order it.  That should take care of the problem for you.  I'm just guessing, but you might be able to cancel your order and then wait until next month or so and then re-order once they are shipping them?
(Edited)
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W2NER

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I've been in contact with flex with the powers at be and they give me that option however the monies already spent. The thing that upsets me the most is when I ordered this in January the website at that time gave me the impression they were in stock and ready to be shipped I didn't notice anything in bold letters or some kind of a big notice stating that they weren't ready for shipment yet that's my biggest beef.

I typically don't get newsletters and when I do it's very infrequent and when I do I don't really have a whole Lotta time to read them. That may be my fault for not reading the newsletter is however that doesn't negate the fact that the website at the time in January gave me the impression otherwise. I typically don't get newsletters very infrequent and when I do I don't really have a whole Lotta time to read them. That may be my fault for not reading the newsletters however that doesn't negate the fact that the website at the time in January gave me the impression otherwise
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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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@Nick

Your responses are too funny..

Pretty obvious you do not come from the small business world.  Likely you have also never founded a company or tried to get a project off the ground with limited resources....

But i hate to break it to you but most large business start off very small and get customer deposits first before they even start to make things... I can think of a few that started that way.. Apple. HP. Dell.....   

My close friend Bill VE3GXR recounts the story when Steve Jobs was first demoing the original Apple at a Hamfest.-- it did not work... so they had to borrow a soldering iron and some chips from Bill (who was a vendor at the show) to fix it....Apple did not have the cash to pay for the chips until they got customer deposits at the show and only had that one almost working prototype...
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W2NER

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You live in a bubble my friend
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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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A Real World Bubble?
Not the rarefied air of the Fortune 500!
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W2NER

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No I gerbil bubble
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Bill -VA3WTB

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Nick, It must really pain Gerald the unit is not ready yet. Things have not gone as planed I'm sure. I don't think this happened just to anger you. When we buy a Flex product we buy into a developing product, and I get you don't want to cut them slack, but it won't be long now and you sure will love it when you get it....
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W2NER

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Oh I'm sure I well and I haven't canceled my order and I've spoken to the Powers at be in detail. It's just my belief you shouldn't offer something for sale on your website unless it's available And if not clearly state that it's for deposit only and List it as such not put it up there for 100% if the cost. Just not the right thing to do
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Rob Fissel

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This thread turned ridiculous. You're point has been made. Many times. It's apparent most people here don't agree with you. Can we just agree to disagree, so my Gmail stops blowing up with reply notifications. 
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W2NER

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Unsubscribe and your problem is solved
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Rob Fissel

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I was just trying to be a little cute with my wording and bring a little humor into the mix. My point is that you're beating a dead horse that died back in January.

You're a consumer, and this is a free market. Want to make a change? Vote with your wallet. This is no different that people ranting on Facebook about how corrupt the political system is, but failing to show up in November to, ya know, actually have your say. 

Also, please don't say that you don't have time to read the Flex newsletters when you have the time to reply to every comment in this thread within 10 minutes of them being posted. It just sounds silly. 
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N3NER

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I'm making an effort to read these ridiculous posts as you put it.  If you have nothing to add, unsubscribe and move on.  This post has to do with good business practice and whats fair.  Don't like what I have to say?  too bad.
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Rob Fissel

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His first post is more than fair. I get it. He doesn't like that it hasn't shipped yet when he had expectations that it would. 100% fair to say so. 

Then the thread completely devolved. Name calling, and now-pointless arguing about something that OP has absolutely no control over. Telling one of the most respected Elmers in the thread that he lives in a gerbil bubble? Calling people "dense customers" because they don't agree wit him? Yeah, I'd classify this entire 2nd page as pretty much ridiculous. 

I'd prefer to not unsubscribe from threads which I anticipate receiving value out of because the content goes off on a bender for no good reason. 

I guess it's time for me to spin the Flex Community VFO dial...
(Edited)
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N3NER

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Yes it is time.  I don't like that fact the he clearly justifies FR's practice and thinks my view is unfair or my expectations are too high.  If your going to blindly support a company and not find any fault with them, don't toss stones at someone who has a valid point of view.   
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N3NER

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Oh so I guess your gmail is NOT getting blown up seing you are not going to unsubscribe . 
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Rob Fissel

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"Don't like what I have to say?  too bad."

Silly logic. Don't like what Flex has to say about estimated shipping dates? Too bad. Don't like that others disagree with your point of view? Too bad. See where I'm going here?

I'm not supporting a company blindly. IMHO, Howard makes valid points about how preordering can help a company raise capital and gauge interest in a future endeavor. I also value his opinion because of his experience in bizdev, software dev, and company management - which to me brings more value and understanding to the table than "THEY SAID IT WOULD SHIP AND IT DIDN'T YET I'M ANGRY, FRS IS A BAD COMPANY WITH BAD BUSINESS PRACTICE."

I ordered a Pixel loop from DXengineering. They purchased the brand from InLogis, and they're in a transition period. I ordered a month ago, when it indicated that it would ship in early February. Well, it's late February, and it hasn't shipped yet. Is it because DXengineering is a bad company? Is it because they make false promises? Is it because they're actively looking to piss off their customers? No, it's because it's not ready yet, there was some unforeseen delays, and it will ship when it's ready. If I was as outraged as you are, I'd simply cancel my order, and not utilize their services again. But I'm not upset. I'm not posting how bad they are on eHam. They have provided open and honest communication with me about the status of the order, and provided me with a little information as to why there is a delay. Pretty much just like Flex has done with the Maestro. For me, that's good customer service, understandable, and a non issue if I have to wait a little longer.

The Maestro will ship when it's ready. Flex has been very open about this, almost to a fault. I get the impression that if they shipped it early, knowing that there were SW/HW issues, you guys would be complaining about that instead. 

Just typed this whole thing up, and now just realized that you're using two separate accounts to make postings? 
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N3NER

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Nope, only one account.  I see everyone's point but it seems my point is being discounted as not giving them time do get it right. My point is and has been, they should not take the full cost of a product they can not deliver, period. 
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Rob Fissel

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I mean, just as an FYI, it would appear that you are using two accounts. One account's name is Nick Riale with a Mopar logo, and the other account's name is W2NER with a picture of you. They even have different numbers of posts and reply likes attached to them. 

Can not deliver, and can not deliver based upon previous estimations are not the same thing, especially with small businesses. Go take a look at estimated delivery times for an SPE amplifier. 

You plopped down money, which BTW they absolutely said using PayPal would charge the full amount and not just deposit amount, when Flex engineers were molding prototype plastic cases in their home ovens. Yet, you seem outraged and shocked that this small business will be a few months late in delivering. No one put a gun to your head to use PayPal and pay the full amount. 
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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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@W3NER.

Since you paid via PayPal and PayPal makes Flex take 100% of the money and you are unhappy with the delay... just call Flex.. ask for a refund.. of the 100% deposit then do a 10% deposit via CC like most people did and you will be back in the queue

Flex is trying to get the product right so most users will be happy with it when it ships

Ultimately its a software product.. so making it perfect is not an option.. but getting it close enough that most people will be happy with it when it finally ships just takes a bit longer.. why because the Alpha Testers (me included) have made a number of operating suggestions to make the product even more user friendly...as with anything that has never been done before these take time to code and test but seem well worth doing......

There is definitely light at the end of the tunnel.. but like all software projects the tunnel keeps on getting a bit longer than Flex first guessed it would be..

BTW.. this conversation seems to bring back old memories of when Flex used to publish a Software Roadmap and missed one of the last release dates..
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W2NER

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I do remember that.
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DrTeeth

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Flex are perfectly entitled to request the full price just as one perfectly entitled not to order on that basis. I assume that Flex will provide a full refund if an order is cancelled. I cannot understand what all the k'vetching is about.
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W2NER

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I want to apologize to anyone I offended. I got a bit heated and not that's this is an excuse but I have been dealing with unemployment. It has been difficult going through all the BS trying to get what I'm initialed too after over 50 years of working. I see so many get all the help from state or government and all they do is sit on their butt doing nothing. It just jerks my chain to no end. Not to mention all the jobs going overseas. Sigh, I'm getting off topic.
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KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

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Understand a small bit of what you may be going through..

My Eldest Son, who was president of a company i founded, fired me in 2012 and then promptly sold the company to a Fortune 500...   after 50+ years of working....
It was definitely rough to not have an office to go to every day.... or worse for me the access to labs, servers, staff and resources that i had been used to....

Fortunately I owned a lot of the stock which was sold or I would have been dealing with unemployment benefits....probably could have applied for unemployment but it felt like taking a double dip at the trough..when others needed it more.....



Bottom Line:  I expect that you will be very pleased with Maestro when Flex finishes all the software and you will find that it is even better than you expected it to be because they took the time and put in the effort to get it right...
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N9VC

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Just a thought, why don't we all step back and take a deep breath
and move on. I feel no good will come of any bickering, so please
let's just drop the thread. We all want our Maestro and Flex wants
to get them to us.

73, Jim N9VC
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John Leonard

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Good grief.... I need to pay closer attention to online finances.... I'm pretty sure I used Paypal.    The good news is I don't think I'm going to need to put out another 899.95 (hopefully real soon). Is there a My account link on the Flex page I can check tonight? 
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k3Tim

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Hi John

https://flexradio.3dcartstores.com/myaccount.asp

You can also check Paypal.  Stating the obvious, these days one has to watch all accounts like a hawk!

I sent FRS a final payment check last week, so the financial part is taken care of.

k3Tim
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Dan -- KC4GO

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Boeing  takes pre-orders all the time and I'm sure they don't build 747's without a lot of money up front. 
Just saying :)
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N3NER

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Someone close this post before I get on my soapbox again.

This conversation is no longer open for comments or replies.