Another update, another mess again, again, again.

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  • Updated 1 year ago
Well, Windows 10  just updated again, after I uninstalled and reinstalled software after the last update.

So it's back to the endless revo uninstall - reinstall process again. 

I love this radio, but I am becoming extremely concerned by it's peripherals. Perhaps my thoughts that an update shouldn't hose things are just unrealistic in the Windows world.
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Michael Coslo

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  • annoyed

Posted 1 year ago

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Mike va3mw

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Windows 10 was discussed in several forum at Dayton this weekend.  

It was highly recommend to spend the $100 and just run the Pro Version so you can control the updates.  This came from several presenters.

I know that doesn't help you at the moment, but I thought I would share.

Mike va3mw
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Jim Gilliam

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Why doesn't Flex have an uninstall program?
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Lee - N2LEE

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The WEAKEST element in the entire Flex system is WINDOWS !!!

I hate it and 99% of all of the problems you see are windows related.
Drivers, Com Ports, blah blah blah.
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Michael Coslo

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Absolutely. I consider my self a zealot, yet at this point in time, I do not recommend Flex Radios to anyone unlesss they are running MacOS or Windows 7. 

It means nothing to me when someone says they have never had a problem - keeping in mind that I fix a lot of other people's computers that have W10 update induced issues. This is real, and it is happening.  
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AA0KM

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Since creative up date no issues. Rest have been small updates and daily anti-virus update.

Computer is updated daily. I hit manual update before I even get started.

Just some have issues some don't. Hope someone finds an answer.


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Ria - N2RJ, Elmer

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What, specifically was borked with the update?
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Michael Coslo

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In the Creator update case, DAX returned error messages, in the previous update, FlexVSP.  There may still be an issue with VSP - it's working, but I had to reinstall twice with the Creator update issue. The previous update also hosed WSJT and WSPR. 
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James Del Principe

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You would think - since the computer is supposed to only serve as a GUI - that a radio of this caliber could have a SBC for display and dispense with the external computer and Windows OS.
A single board computer is not expensive in this day and age. They have been around in various forms forever.
Am I wrong in thinking this?
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Michael Coslo

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Do not want. I run a lot of different software that interfaces with SSDR, like WSPR, WSJT, fldigi suite, its integration with Web Browser, and N1MM. 

My Computer is the heart of my station, not just a peripheral. Having SSDR and the Flex has been great for all of the communication between programs and hardawre that I need.
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Chuck

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Michael,
Which update was it? Creator or a different one?  Same thing happened to me with the Creator update on a non-flex program. Was working with a VHF/UHF dongle and NOAA WX capture, Win10 updated to Creator, fired up the Dongle again and it was inop.  I agree with your frustration.

Chuck
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Michael Coslo

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Creator update was the latest borkage. The one earlier in the week  hammered VSP, and Creator took out DAX. Admittidely I am spoiled, because my other computers are essentially 100 percent uptime, but sheesh. It's like I said before, this radio feels like a Ferrari with bicycle wheels when I run it on Windos 10.
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Bill Perkins

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My Flex computer runs Windows 7, auto update is turned off. I am thinking of moving my regular computer back to 7 because everytime I want to use it I have to wait 30 minutes for updates to load/start/finish/something. Microsoft is the biggest reason tablets are taking over.
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Mike va3mw

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Hi Bill

Be cautious on turning off updates on Win 7.  They just reported that Windows 7 was the most impacted by WannyCry ransome ware.  

According to data released today by Kaspersky Lab, roughly 98 percent of the computers affected by the ransomware were running some version of Windows 7, with less than one in a thousand running Windows XP. 2008 R2 Server clients were also hit hard, making up just over 1 percent of infections.


Mike va3mw

https://www.theverge.com/2017/5/19/15665488/wannacry-windows-7-version-xp-patched-victim-statistics
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Bill Perkins

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I am am IT professional. Windows 7 updates I choose. Windows 10 "updates" are jammed down our throats, often 90% or more OS replacements, that is why critical settings and registry entries are lost. Last week's "update": I wanted to send a quick email before work, turned the computer on, saw the "Don't turn off your computer..."message. An hour later I leave for work, sent the email from my tablet, the PC was still updating. This is an i7, 32G, fast machine.

No, my Flex stays on Windows 7 and I'll choose when and what gets updated.
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Michael Coslo

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Agreed - The creators update took a long time. Also beware, the security settings get reset, so we need to check them, unless we're cool with handing MS the keys to the kingdom. 

As long as we don't click on the phishbait, we don't get hit. Which certainly for My W10 machine, I have no email on it anyhow, only the bare minimum I need to run SSDR, and the other Digital radio software I need. 
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Mike va3mw

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One thing I want to make clear.  This does not happen to most people either on Win 7 or Win 10.  While I do not have exact metrics, it is a small portion of the community.  I run Win 7 and Win 10 and as an Alpha tester, I am always trying new versions of SmartSDR and without issue.

So, there is something different between those with no problem and those with problems.  Could it be OEM versions of Windows, how you got to Win 10?  Registry issues.  Who knows, as we are just guessing for the most part unless we start to do an audit on the differences.

If this helps, my computers (over 6 of them) are stock.  No fancy tools other than AVG PC Tuneup which actually does work.  My AV is Defender and no other add ons that work under the covers of Windows.  They are loaded with the usual office programs and just about every common ham program.

For those of you that are having issues, what else might you be running in a 'resident' mode (aka - monitoring) that might be sticking its hooks into SSDR installs and Windows updates?  

If it was me, I would go look in 'Add/Remove Programs' and see if anything is there that you don't remember adding, or don't need.   Somewhere, this is a common theme to this.

(nice, most of my update got truncated) ... i'll have to re-write.
(Edited)
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Michael Coslo

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I have a 4 month old HP envy 7th generation i5-7200U @2.71 GHz, 12 GBytes RAM that I run only the bare minimum to run SSDR and the other digital programs I need. Windows 10 Home 64 bit.

I run the SSDR suite, obviously. I run N1MM, I run WSJT and WSPR, and fldigi and it's suite of programs. I run a second monitor on it.


Task manager shows the regular windows processes, with wsprappx Client license service and AppX deployment service, Network time synchronizer and CCleaner, all those at 0 %

I gotta have the time sync, and WSPR. CCleaner I could do without until I need it. Regardless, I have an identical setup on my W7 machine, so if it were one of these, it would still be a W10 problem.

I also have Windows 7 Pro on a Mac running via bootcamp, with no problems so far. 


I'd simply love for this to be my fault, something I am doing wrong. The fix would then be easy - just me stopping whatever I am doing wrong.

Now to be clear, I help other people troubleshoot their computers, and SSDR is not the only program to be affected by Windows 10 updates. There is a big problem with drivers getting changed, or W10 insists the wrong driver is the right one. Some people are also getting the eternal reboot, which I thought went away after XP. I have ot get my hands on the eternal update computers, but I use team viewer a lot because especially with the audio drivers, the victim runs the troubleshooter and it says everything is perfect, so rather than argue, I can just get in and fix their computer for them. I don't think that the problem with W10 updates is quite as rare as many think. Of course, I don't see these folk unless they have  problem 8^)

Anyhow my cure  for the moment is a lot of unstall - reinstallation
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Michael Coslo

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Forgot to add -  If we need a specific version of Windows 10, say the Enterprise version, and a specific computer to run it on, then perhaps we should be told what the requirements are.
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Mike va3mw

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The real challenge is having the tools to diagnose the issue.  We don't know whose problem this is to solve.  Is it Microsoft, FRS, etc.   Right now, we have no idea who owns the problem.

That is one of the key supportability issues in Windows.  If you haven't you might want to poke around the event log and see if there are any clues.

Once we can determine that, then we know who to call.  

I seriously wish we had a better tool to narrow this down.  

Mike
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jim

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I quess I'm just lucky.. None of the windows 10 updates have effected any version of the

Flex software that I have use.  Makes me wonder....

Jim


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Michael Coslo

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If you think we're doing something wrong, I'd love to hear what you think it is, Jim.

Here's the issue AFAIAK. I come from the Unix world, and am used to installing then working. I have Used Microsoft since MS-DOS and supported Windows since XP days, and updates have always broken things. Now with Windows 10, most of us have no choice about updates. I have a internet isolated Windows 10 network that has run perfectly since day one.

I could buy the Enterprise Edition and avoid the updates, but I already gave money to Microsoft for an OS already.

I'm also not at all worried about being right. If I have done something stupid, and its pointed out, I'll be grateful.

My cure for the problem isn't particularly elegant. It's a complete uninstall-reinstall refresh program that people can run any time a W10 update hoses SSDR. Automagically saves the profiles, then upon reinstall it loads them back in. This would be especially nice for less experienced computer people. But it would also be nice as a convenience. And for people for whom SSDR always works perfectly after updates, you don't need to use it.

For now, I have adopted a policy in the future that whenever W10 upgrades, I'll Revo uninstall (basically a scorched earth uninstall) and reinstall manually and reload the profiles manually before I even try to use the radio. That way I can just incorporate it into the workflow, and not get P-O'ed because of my expectations that updates should leave running software running.

But that sure ain't right.
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Larry Benoit

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FYI, the Windows 10 Creators update hosed my Flex VSP com ports (corrupted registry settings, according to an error message in Device Manager).  I ran the program repair routine for Flex VSP Manager  (Control Panel > Programs > Programs and Features) and that solved the problem.

I did not uninstall SmartSDR before the update, but it did kill DAX and SmartCAT. 

73,
Larry KB1VFU