80 meter zoo

  • 3
  • Question
  • Updated 3 years ago
Last night around mid-night I was using the K6TU iPad app to just scroll around and listen to various activities going on.  In addition I was continuing to test the HRI Agent app and look at the updates.

I got on 80 voice around 3840 or so I think and came across a group of stations that were very strong.  But what I heard would make a longshoreman blush.  It was really unbelievable.

I'm not normally one to rat on people but one of the guys was so crude and rude I think I'm going to report him.  I mean it was a real disgrace that these guys were acting this way and probably running 2kw or more each so the entire world could hear them.

In a span of 10 minutes I counted the F-bomb being dropped at least 25 times.  There were other references to body parts both male and female in the negative way multiple times.  Name calling was prevalent as insults were thrown back and forth with the F-bombs and body part references being the main subject matter.

I'm no prude. I've heard all these words before and they don't scare me.  The only reason I bring it up here is to point out that we are better than this.  I know that a few bad apples should not spoil the barrel but it is just sad to hear crap like that going on.  At one point a guy with a call ending in YTT played music and bad music at that.

I remember in the 80's there was a guy that showed up on one of our repeaters using lousy language and later hearing about a nice visit from the FCC and a big fine.  I guess we are past those days now with budget cuts and the like. 

It is just sad to see this crap going on. I have lived my life with the motto that if I don't have something positive to say and I'm not asked to share my opinion, I don't.  Perhaps that is why I listen more than I tx because sometimes I don't have much to say.

Anyway hopefully these guys blow up their amps or something.  If I could figure out where they lived and had the money to travel I'd seriously consider a trip there and apply some creative shorting to their antennas for the next time they flip on the 2kw.  Not really but one likes to imagine their faces if that was done!
Photo of Mark - WS7M

Mark - WS7M

  • 993 Posts
  • 353 Reply Likes

Posted 3 years ago

  • 3
Photo of DrTeeth

DrTeeth

  • 1687 Posts
  • 387 Reply Likes
There are words other than "crap" you could use as appropriate adjectives. The phrase about people in glass houses springs to mind.
(Edited)
Photo of Richard McClelland, AA5S

Richard McClelland, AA5S

  • 271 Posts
  • 52 Reply Likes
ar ar...
Photo of Dave - W6OVP

Dave - W6OVP

  • 218 Posts
  • 69 Reply Likes
I grew up farm country where CRAP is what is said in polite company.  And those who feign a sniffy offense are told to take a flying ****. Imposing Political Correctness on others is a far bigger problem.

Like I told a young foreign relative going off to college in America, "You have no right to not be offended. So get over it."

That said, 80 Meters has long being a mess; decades long. The only question is why doesn't the FCC take action?
Photo of Barry Meltzer

Barry Meltzer

  • 3 Posts
  • 3 Reply Likes
PATHETIC!  The 80 meter players are now on 7200 and 7185.  The FCC's position is "freedom of speech" which is pure BS.   Hollingsworth  needs to come out of retirement with the big gun on his hip.  $$$Fine them and rip the license away. No coddling.   De K3MY
Photo of Dave - W6OVP

Dave - W6OVP

  • 218 Posts
  • 69 Reply Likes
Agreed. I think if Hollingsworth was in charge things would change quickly. The ongoing willful interference and deliberate harassment on 80M is pervasive and certainly must be in violation of something. (Also the obvious use of other hams call letters.)
(Edited)
Photo of Burt Fisher

Burt Fisher

  • 1049 Posts
  • 366 Reply Likes
He was in charge while this all increased.
Photo of Walt

Walt

  • 236 Posts
  • 74 Reply Likes
During the day, it is on 7255 KHz.  Same bunch that has been doing this for at least a year that I have heard them.  One of them is the CA station with the FCC $25,000 fine.  They also go up and jam some net on 3908 KHz a few times a week for good measure.

It seems they stick to themselves and not roam around jamming other hams.   There always has to be a place for people like that.  Wasn't it Maxim who came up with the Wouff Hong for such a crowd almost 100 years ago? 

Technology changes, but people seem to act the same.  And as you can see on those frequencies, it only takes a dozen to so.

Oh boy !    A RTTY contest with RTTY filters !    (can FSK be far behind?)

Cheers
Photo of Ernest - W4EG

Ernest - W4EG

  • 594 Posts
  • 116 Reply Likes
This has being going since I can remember; just move the dial and you will run into a conversation that may please your ears.
W4EG license since 1060
Photo of Barry N1EU

Barry N1EU

  • 495 Posts
  • 121 Reply Likes
Please do report them Mark, assuming they gave their callsigns.  I would do the same.
Photo of KF4HR

KF4HR

  • 507 Posts
  • 140 Reply Likes
It can be a zoo alright, particularly at night.  Some say, if you don't like what you hear, tune somewhere else, but even that doesn't always work.  Occasionally you'll hear some one break into these foul language conversations and ask that they clean up their act, but normally this only makes matters worse. 

Sometimes the language is more civilized in the Advanced or Extra phone sub-bands, but not always.  The CW and digital sub-bands are where I prefer to operate.  It's much more civilized there.  

I agree with Barry.  Given enough reports and recordings, the FCC will eventually take action.           
Photo of Walt - KZ1F

Walt - KZ1F

  • 3040 Posts
  • 643 Reply Likes
Is 'gosh darn it' really different than what we all know its short for? Is 'what a fracking mess' really not swearing? I personally think the answer to both is no. So if these are acceptable why not the others? My understanding is profanity was dropped from Part 97.

97.113.4 does have indescent or obscene, but the term profanity was dropped. Is language used in everyday discourse still obscene?

Is language freely used in a men's locker room indescent in front of a lady? My understanding is language freely used in the women's locker room is no different.

I think the level of civility has dropped precipitously in the last 50 yrs and I don't condone it (in case people were reading that in). But I think the subject is thornier than on might think at first blush.

Yes, certainly report it and see if any action is taken. It may well be most people assume the FCC is pretty much toothless now.
(Edited)
Photo of Ken - NM9P

Ken - NM9P, Elmer

  • 3970 Posts
  • 1225 Reply Likes
It is interesting how society has changed...nowadays, if someone discusses their faith, or talks about God, it is deemed as unacceptable offensive behavior in many circles. Yet it seems to be commonplace for the name of God or Jesus to be used as swear words with no regard to how this offends people of faith. Personally I find these expressions much more offensive than s-bombs or f-bombs. Those merely describe bodily functions (albeit in crude and offensive ways). But the other profanes what religious people find deeply holy and important. Looking at national TV and radio standards, they are very concerned about body function references, and unconcerned about profaning and insulting the faith of millions of people. It has always seemed pretty incongruent to me.

Nevertheless it would be nice if hams at least realized that these are public airways and at least minimal decorum should be observed. It used to be that peer pressure from and Amateur community was somewhat effective at keeping things in check. It is no more.
(Edited)
Photo of Dave - W6OVP

Dave - W6OVP

  • 218 Posts
  • 69 Reply Likes
Good comment, Ken. I am secondarily offended by those who cannot distinguish between the taking of the name of God in vain, and the mere demonstration of vulgarity.
Photo of Walt - KZ1F

Walt - KZ1F

  • 3040 Posts
  • 643 Reply Likes
Yes, excellent point Ken/Dave. But why is it 'darn it' gets a pass whereas the original full length version doesn't. I think it disengenuous to freely use 'gosh darn it' thinking somehow that makes it all better. It doesn't nor does BS different than its full length version, just less letters to finger, as opposed to type.
Photo of Steve K9ZW

Steve K9ZW, Elmer

  • 1272 Posts
  • 655 Reply Likes
@Ken - the faithless little understand the power of an oath taken, even if taken without gravitas.  One could say they speak without any other virtue as well.

As these folk usual say they are faithless, it deeply troubles that they would particularly pick words of the faithful to swear with.  Beside the offense to many of us otherwise bystanders to their dullard's exhibitions, it logically contradicts their claims of faithlessness.  

That they would put words on the air that prove they are clueless is perhaps poetic justice.

When I've heard some vile stuff on the air and the ham doing it spurns my quiet counsel, I've mad it a point to have them recorded and copy blind emailed to their XYL with a suggestion that the ham needs some help to regain his moral compass.

This technique has worked about half of the time.  

I borrowed the idea from an old priest I knew who loved his new fangled digital recorder, and would quietly play back to a person their own voice with their unwise words with a gentle admonishment that perhaps the person could do better?

In many ways that is exactly what the OO Program was to be, those quiet friendly words of advice that a ham was off track.  I know this works.

 I've never figured out where the pride in being bad mouthed could even come from - I mean some of these folk are organized foul-mouths with logos and even jackets to wear to Dayton!  

So it is a club within our hobby - a faithless club rewarding with peer support on-air blasphemy and obscenity.  Sad.

There is an upside though Ken - the grace that they can reform and repent is always there.  

And until such time as they take up all the bandwidth, we get to spin the dial leaving them behind.

73

Steve K9ZW
Photo of Mark - WS7M

Mark - WS7M

  • 993 Posts
  • 353 Reply Likes
@Ken,

Agreed.  I practice my religion in my own way but I try very hard not to offend others and one area I stay away from is the use of God related cursing.  I can find plenty of other ways to curse if I need to and I also don't like f-bomb and other expletive deleted.

I'm no prude, I just choose to be more positive about things.

My reason for posting this was my shock over the following:

1) The clear use of the words that could offend some people with LOTS of power behind them.

2) The direct attacks on each other OVER THE AIR calling each other names generally associated with female but also male body parts.  Again over the air with lots of power.

3) The flagrant violation of the rules.  I try hard in my life to live by our rules as best I can.  Am I perfect, no but I also do not intentionally or purposefully violate the rules.  I might not like them but a rule is a rule and I live by them.

My respect for the rules includes piracy.  I own every piece of software I use OR I have a clear understanding I'm using it under a public license and my use is allowed.  

Anyway I might sound like a "goody two-shoes" to some of you.  Trust me as a former pilot, rock band guitarist and keyboardist I can roll with just about anything.  I just made the choice to be better.
Photo of Ken ve7kwa

Ken ve7kwa

  • 97 Posts
  • 32 Reply Likes
Seriously agree... something needs to be done about the mess !   Imagine my dismay after bragging the hobby up to no end, only to have the shack guest tune across the 80 mtr  "zoo"  unabated, in full swing. It was and is... Very Embarrassing ! Whatever action deemed necessary, we should all try to put some effort into cleaning things up. Yes... I know it is an imperfect world and there have always been "Lids"  But recently it has come to a point that I'm feeling reluctant at times to tell people I'm a Ham.  Not a good sign....
Photo of Lee

Lee, Elmer

  • 677 Posts
  • 285 Reply Likes
I've been on the air since 1963 and I've always been a 75M op.  75 has been like this since my first night on the band.  It's far less aggressive these days than back in the 60/70's.  In general it's about the liquor.  Except for clear power violations (I had a buddy cracked by the feds for running 30KW (3cx15000 with 3 phase into his garage, He was truly LOUD) or really annoying malicious interference not much is going to get done to fix this.  I just turn the knob (click the mouse).  There were a couple jokers in KY running 10KW who used to hook up the VFO knob to a geared down motor and just undulate up and down the band.  

73  W9OY
(Edited)
Photo of Mike W9OJ

Mike W9OJ

  • 86 Posts
  • 27 Reply Likes
The July 1960 issue of Popular Electronics has an article entitled 
"The Strange Inhabitants of 75 Meter Phone" on page 66

http://www.americanradiohistory.com/Archive-Poptronics/60s/60/Pop-1960-07.pdf

Truly not new.

73 de Mike W9OJ
Photo of Dave - W6OVP

Dave - W6OVP

  • 218 Posts
  • 69 Reply Likes
Thanks for the old magazine, Mike. It was wonderful to see all those old ads and truly helpful articles and projects again. I used to subscribe to most of the mags then and learned SO MUCH from them. They were a far cry from the sad jokes called magazines we see today.

I think few people realize that the very best ELECTRONICS magazine in the 1950s was Popular MECHANICS! It had wonderful radio projects, complete with schematics and pictorials of the finished product. And you could mail in a dime or two and get wall sized BLUEPRINTS of the schematic and pictos. That's where I built my first radios and other projects, and still have the prints.
Photo of Lee

Lee, Elmer

  • 677 Posts
  • 285 Reply Likes
Hey Zeke good to see you OM  Thanks for the link.  Even a Carl and Jerry and an article about my first TR switch a knife switch  73  and -30-

W9OY
Photo of Ken ve7kwa

Ken ve7kwa

  • 97 Posts
  • 32 Reply Likes
Well I haven't been on the air since 63 for sure and like I said "There have always been lids"  but in my experience  it is definitely  more prevalent in recent years. Regardless... too many times I hear people justifying doing nothing under the guise of "It's always been like this"   In Canada the authorities are just as lax about it as in the U.S. Maybe more so.   In fact... we have one of the biggest Waco's right here in B.C.  and he carries on at will.   No, I don't think the hobby is in jeopardy but it would be so much nicer to be rid of at least the worst offenders.   YMMV    Off to check the new Flex HRI app... Good work Mark !
Photo of Mike - N8MSA

Mike - N8MSA

  • 28 Posts
  • 19 Reply Likes
I hate to be a killjoy, but is it really necessary to whinge about this here rather than, say...QRZ? What does this have to do with Flex Radio products?
Photo of Burt Fisher

Burt Fisher

  • 1049 Posts
  • 366 Reply Likes
You must be fun at parties if the conversations skews a bit, there you are to keep it on track.
Photo of Mark - WS7M

Mark - WS7M

  • 993 Posts
  • 353 Reply Likes
I posted it here Mike because I feel a connection with this community whereas I do not with QRZ forums.  In fact I often feel alienated there.

I'm sorry if this bothers you but I've seen lots of different posts here on FlexForums many on and many off the topic of Flex Radio.
Photo of Mike - N8MSA

Mike - N8MSA

  • 28 Posts
  • 19 Reply Likes
Most of the "off-topic" posts have at least a tertiary relation to FRS products; this has none and only serves to lower the signal/noise ratio of the Community. Even at that, I fail to see what good will come of complaining here about something that's been going on unabated for half of a century.

I have no more 'say-so' over the content of the FRS Community than any other user, but I would much rather it focus on FRS products and not become another iteration of a Internet rag-chew net.
Photo of Walt - KZ1F

Walt - KZ1F

  • 3040 Posts
  • 643 Reply Likes
Well, this is an interesting point, and one I've not a good answer for after being on here over 2 years. Is this a "community enhanced Flex support forum, as the name on Home says? In which case Mike is correct. Or, is this a community of Flex users that pretty much raise any little issue / thought that comes into someone's head. I suspect it's intent is the former, as it is hosted on a corporate website, and it is, de facto, the later.  I further suspect, so long as FRS has contented cows, they don't much care. It does seem, however, there are about a half dozen of so on here that tend to hold sway over what they consider to be inbound and out of bound. But that dichotomy does tend to cause friction on occasion.
(Edited)
Photo of Ken - NM9P

Ken - NM9P, Elmer

  • 3970 Posts
  • 1225 Reply Likes
Mike,
I sincerely appreciate your concern for the integrity and quality of the Community.  I have occasionally felt the need to interject some "sugar-coated calming medicine" when some of my friends got a little heated in the midst of a discussion, whether on or off topic.  (And I do mean friends. I like to consider everyone here a friend...even those who occasionally get under my skin or rub me the wrong way.  Life is too short to hold grudges.)

But on the other hand, a LITTLE whinging never hurt anyone.  
I'll cut someone some slack for the occasional OT post, and even participate a little if it suits me.  The only time it really bothers me is when people make it personal with insults, name calling, and the macho "measuring the length of each other's coax jumpers," etc.

Just like the occasional cesspools in certain parts of the HF bands, usually if I don't appreciate the topic or the tone, I will quietly tune off frequency, or click another thread....unless the contents are abusive enough to warrant a kind suggestion to change the tone of the discussion.
 
Besides, we all need something to do to blow off our pent-up energy while waiting for the next software release!  I have noticed a pattern of increasing testiness shortly before each new software release....sort of like kids acting up before Christmas.  ha.

In friendship,

Ken - NM9P
Photo of KY6LA - Howard

KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

  • 3541 Posts
  • 1396 Reply Likes
My mother taught me

"Sticks And Stone will break ypur bones but Names will never hurt you"

Do we really need all this PC Crap about restricting what people say. Frankly we have enough PC crap in colleges these days.

I have been a ham since 1958. It was much more raunchy back then.

If you don't like it spin the VFO and don't listen.
Photo of SteveJ

SteveJ

  • 83 Posts
  • 25 Reply Likes
That's not the answer. Just to ignore it?  Report them.
Photo of DrTeeth

DrTeeth

  • 1687 Posts
  • 387 Reply Likes
That is the 'problem' with free speech, what is said sometimes offends. It is much better than the alternative. I run a small forum. The atmosphere that I wanted and what we have is like friends chatting in private whilst having a few beers. Several things have been said which *deeply* offend me, but no PMs ever issued, no warnings ever issued  and no censorship will ever be introduced. Before people sign up, they are warned.
Photo of Walt - KZ1F

Walt - KZ1F

  • 3040 Posts
  • 643 Reply Likes
Haven't the clowns on 14.312 or 311, been stirring it up for decades?
Photo of Mark - WS7M

Mark - WS7M

  • 993 Posts
  • 353 Reply Likes
@Guy

That is the right way to do it Guy.  I've been in your shoes on several occasions and it is very difficult as the moderator/owner to not get clicky and ban some one or send a PM when your hair is raised over something being said or going on.

You practice what I call a self-moderating forum.  I was never successful at that so much respect your way.

Mark
Photo of Mark - WS7M

Mark - WS7M

  • 993 Posts
  • 353 Reply Likes
@Howard.  Yup you can do that.  I felt it was worth talking to "friends" about since I'm kind of getting back into things.  I didn't intend to create a war thread with this.  I definitely live by the motto of spin the dial until you are happy.

Over my years I've moderated about 15 different online systems and each has had its own unique personality including the good and the bad.  The waves will come no matter what the community is.  One board I moderated was a church board I created for the members.  Talk about a dynamic group. There were more insults flying in those forums than I heard the other night on 75.  Well perhaps without the not so nice words.   Just goes to show it doesn't matter your background when people interact and they have the safety of being hidden behind a screen, mouse and keyboard that often times things are said that would never be said face-to-face.

@Mike.  Sorry this thread bothers you but I suggest you follow Howards advice and spin the mouse to another thread.  I'm not saying that to be mean or create an enemy but the subject is posted, it has quite a few responses so your comments about "not doing this" really don't apply except to educate me in the future that there are some here that won't tolerate an off topic post.

Without any doubt your response will make me think twice before asking of this community something not related to flex radios.  But really I can draw anything back to flex.  The way I found the offending crowd on 75 was using the wonderful pan adapter which showed this blasting signal up the band a ways.  With a traditional radio and filters set I might not have heard it.  So in effect this is kind of flex related in a very strained and remote way.

Anyway no hard feelings.  I will try harder to keep posts oriented towards Flex products in the future and reserve my rants and questions that are off topic for some other place that I have yet to find.

@Ken, Yes I'm a kid desperately missing my Maestro under the tree this Christmas so I'm gonna whine a little!  :-)
Photo of KY6LA - Howard

KY6LA - Howard, Elmer

  • 3541 Posts
  • 1396 Reply Likes
@Mark
I guess I have a pretty thick skin but I really don't give a damn about how and what people say speak about on the air. If I don't like it I can always spin the dial.

Frankly I am much more concerned about the PC attempts by the"Old Ladies" to shut down the First Amendment. This PC Crap has already infected our colleges where profeessors are fired for daring to say words that might offend someone..

This PC Crap is far more dangerous to us than any allegedly profanity, irreligious statement or sexual innuendo
Photo of Tom--W4FAS

Tom--W4FAS

  • 44 Posts
  • 10 Reply Likes
Good Morning and Happy New Year to All,

This thread is definitely related to FRS. In fact it is all Gerald's fault. I can guarantee you that if I had just downloaded SSDR 1.6 or received my Maestro in the mail I would not be taking the time to add my 2 cents worth.

I have pretty much practiced the " Just Spin The Knob " tactic over the years. I must confess on a few occasions I felt uncomfortable with it because I knew I was just taking the easy way out. On a couple of occasions I spoke up and it turned out well. On one occasion it was, not while on the radio, but in a crowed lobby waiting with my family to get into a movie. I mention this because sometimes Hams don't remember that, anything they say may be heard by anyone who happens to be, tuning across the frequency. They are in a Public Place. I thought about this recently while showing my young grandson my flex and avoided certain areas of 40m and 80m.

I would entertain you with more wisdom according to W4FAS, but I think I hear the UPS truck and then I have to check the latest FRS Downloads.

Tom